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Just remember Bob, voting for the wrong people to "protect it" as you say, could have outrageous consequences for folks like you and i and others on this site who spend their entire lives in the outdoors. Hidden agendas play a big role in things like this. Thats what i mean when i say "they can take it". Plus, the mining industry doesn't even come close to what the oil companies make, period! Just a drop in the bucket. 

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Personally, I'd like it if the government quit raising taxes, quit dreaming of ways -- like this royalties scheme -- to milk more money out of Americans and cut about 1/2 of the bureaucrats out of gov

As we speak there is a mining company that has done just about everything wrong they can out here in Nevada, between Eureka and Ely  off of hwy.50 First they destroyed miles of historic hwy. 40 by hau

They pay royalties to extract oil. Why not minerals?  They pay royalties to the State. To private owners. Why not to the people? Public Land belongs to the people. Corporations who intend to

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The highest i could find for 2019 net income for the mining industry was $82 billion dollars for ALL mineable minerals in the US. 2019 net for the oil industry was $330 billion dollars. So out of that $82 billion dollars, add a royalty of whatever percentage you think is fair for a "LAND OWNER". 

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41 minutes ago, nugget108 said:

The highest i could find for 2019 net income for the mining industry was $82 billion dollars for ALL mineable minerals in the US. 2019 net for the oil industry was $330 billion dollars. So out of that $82 billion dollars, add a royalty of whatever percentage you think is fair for a "LAND OWNER". 

1% is 820 million that could be used to prop up the infrastructure that mining companies use to do business.  Roads, bridges, highways....etc.  I just made up a number.  It could even be less than 1% and still be very significant.

It's 'funny' the different perspectives displayed here.  I never once thought I would somehow get a 'royalty' check in the mail.  It seems obvious to me, since I don't want my personal income taxes raised to eventually pay for all the things that are now overdue for repairs.  The money has to come from somewhere.  What do you guys think about toll roads? :4chsmu1:

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6 hours ago, Dakota Slim said:

I'm hiding this post and Bob's reply/question because it's off topic, has nothing to do with mining royalties!

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So the mining industry produces about 25% as much as the oil industry.

And we should just forget about asking metals mines to pay royalties like a potash mine or a coal mine?

Why? Is there a reason metals mining should pay no royalties but a coal mine should? 

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6 minutes ago, Au Seeker said:

I'm hiding this post and Bob's reply/question because it's off topic, has nothing to do with mining royalties!

I don't know Skip. Slim might have been trying to make a point. Some type of analogy between regulating production water and mining royalties.

I couldn't make sense of his post or how it related but I wanted to give him a chance to explain. I honestly could not figure out how it supported any argument he was making but I was ready to listen to what he had to say. If he had anything to say.

 

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6 minutes ago, Bedrock Bob said:

I don't know Skip. Slim might have been trying to make a point. Some type of analogy between regulating production water and mining royalties.

I couldn't make sense of his post or how it related but I wanted to give him a chance to explain. I honestly could not figure out how it supported any argument he was making but I was ready to listen to what he had to say. If he had anything to say.

 

Bob, I'm not sure what point he was trying to make, all I know is nothing at the posted link had anything to do with mining nor royalties and as such it has been removed so the topic doesn't drift off topic as they always seem to do. 

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18 minutes ago, Bedrock Bob said:

So the mining industry produces about 25% as much as the oil industry.

And we should just forget about asking metals mines to pay royalties like a potash mine or a coal mine?

Why? Is there a reason metals mining should pay no royalties but a coal mine should? 

The mining royalties suggested by the named Democrats probably wouldn't stop mining but it would add to the burdens miners face. It would definitely add cost to the minerals which would ultimately be paid by consumers. It would cause fewer jobs in the mining sector and add more government jobs. More government jobs means higher taxes. 
After 8 years of high taxes and more regulation by the Democrats (Obama & Biden), the economy boomed with Trump's tax and regulation cuts. The miners benefitted, the consumer benefitted and the number of US jobs hit an all time high. 
In case you haven't noticed, GOLD hit an all time high and is holding at very miner friendly price!

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26 minutes ago, Au Seeker said:

I'm hiding this post and Bob's reply/question because it's off topic, has nothing to do with mining royalties!

Sorry Skip. I should have quoted Bob's post which said something about NM's heavy reliance on oil and gas royalties. I did a little research on the subject and thought the article I posted about a potential ban on fracking was relevant.  

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1 hour ago, Dakota Slim said:

Sorry Skip. I should have quoted Bob's post which said something about NM's heavy reliance on oil and gas royalties. I did a little research on the subject and thought the article I posted about a potential ban on fracking was relevant.  

I guess that was the disconnect.  Slim misunderstood The article he posted.

The article wasn't about a potential ban on fracking. It was just another chapter in the ongoing saga of what to do with all that production water.

They don't want them to use production water for fracking because it can have toxins and radioactive elements in it. There is an ongoing lawsuit from environmental groups to stop using production water for fracking. Slims article just explained that. 

Im not sure how it supported his argument or if it was supposed too. It was about oil and New Mexico and I think Slim figured that it made sense. Somehow.

I pointed out that oil royalties were our biggest income. It was meant to draw a correlation between oil royalties and mining royalties. But I think Slim thought someone changed the subject to oil and so he started talking about that. 

My point was that oil is a huge income for New Mexico. And oil pays royalties for extraction on public land. Just as mining should.

I know you are all terrified that the mining industry will collapse if they have to pay a little to mine public resources. And the devastation and pestilence that will ensue will probably be the end of our freedoms. But I just don't see that happening. To me it seems ridiculous that they should be allowed to mine public resources without paying royalties like everyone else.

If royalties are crippling the mining industry on one hand but don't ammount to enough to bother with on the other.... Can anyone tell me how much copper mining royalties contribute to the State of Arizona?

Probably some insignificant little amount that is doing more harm to the industry than benefit to the taxpayer...:inocent:

 

 

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And that was in 2011. There were many more numbers but im at work right now at the NON ROYALTY paying mine i work at, so my search time was limited 😃. Just being a smart ...   So that was just for Arizona. Add in all of the other western states, and the numbers are huge for taxes paid, employees wages and the money spent in the states from the company and the employees. Remember, you can survive without gas and oil. You would have to go back to the old ways of living, but EVERYTHING around you is either mined or grown. 

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Is the mine you work at situated on public land? Or is the mine on a mix of property? 

No doubt mining creates a lot of revenue. There is no argument there. Good paying jobs too.

I'm not trying to change anyones minds here. I'm just shaking the beehive a little before the election. Workin' Slim up into a lather electonically with my thumb on my phone. 

 

 

 

 

 

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59 minutes ago, Bedrock Bob said:

Is the mine you work at situated on public land? Or is the mine on a mix of property? 

No doubt mining creates a lot of revenue. There is no argument there. Good paying jobs too.

I'm not trying to change anyones minds here. I'm just shaking the beehive a little before the election. Workin' Slim up into a lather electonically with my thumb on my phone. 

 

 

 

 

 

I know Bob, i usually dont debate much but as i get older i find myself doing it more and more. I usually just like kicking back and watching the firework show lol. Maybe if i haven't been in the industry for so long and seen what the benefits are in the state and surrounding communities, i would have a different perspective?? Heck i dont know. I will tell ya, the best deer and elk hunting i have done are on and around the big mines. Most of the mines here are 90% public land. There are little sections of patented or private ground that are usually owned by the mine fully. Thats usually where they set up the shops and the offices. 

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Just an interesting little bit of info i came across. I really thought there were more active metal mines than what there is.

20201024_150930.jpg

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Can you think of a reason why all those other thousands of mines must pay royalties and the 295 metals mines do not?

How did that happen? Why does everyone else pay but the metals mines are exempt?

 

 

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15 minutes ago, Bedrock Bob said:

Can you think of a reason why all those other thousands of mines must pay royalties and the 295 metals mines do not?

How did that happen? Why does everyone else pay but the metals mines are exempt?

 

 

Gee Bob. Maybe to give certain types of people something to whine about?
What is the current royalty on sand and gravel?

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2 hours ago, Bedrock Bob said:

Can you think of a reason why all those other thousands of mines must pay royalties and the 295 metals mines do not?

How did that happen? Why does everyone else pay but the metals mines are exempt?

 

 

It has to do with the 1872 mining laws. Since Grant was president, supposedly the laws really haven't changed. The article i read did say that the gold,silver and copper mines have only produced a little over $300 billion dollars since then. Dont know how true that is, but that last post i posted said $82 billion for 2019 for ALL mineral mining. So maybe? 

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2 hours ago, Dakota Slim said:

Gee Bob. Maybe to give certain types of people something to whine about?
What is the current royalty on sand and gravel?

It is certainly not enough to kill the aggregate industry. I haven't heard of a gravel shortage anywhere. 

When oil goes up gravel is expensive. That is the driving factor in the price of gravel. Since Russia and OPEC worked their magic on the price of oil in Febuary it is much cheaper for a yard of concrete or a ton of stone. 

I know a fellow who runs a big borrow pit for a local construction company. I'll ask him how much they pay. They have three gravel pits and a hot mix plant and they handle most of the aggregate for the road construction in the area so he probably will be savvy on how that works. I know the pit he works at is a BLM pit. They sell aggregate and dimensioned stone for concrete and rock walls too. It is a big outfit.

I have never heard him whine about royalties. Only you Slim. It is not a subject that I have discussed much until you brought it up. 

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23 minutes ago, nugget108 said:

It has to do with the 1872 mining laws. Since Grant was president, supposedly the laws really haven't changed. The article i read did say that the gold,silver and copper mines have only produced a little over $300 billion dollars since then. Dont know how true that is, but that last post i posted said $82 billion for 2019 for ALL mineral mining. So maybe? 

I bet you are right. It probably made sense back in 1872 when metals mines were small or individual operations and they wanted to incentivize discovery.

Now that the industry has changed so much it seems to make a lot less sense. At least in my way of thinking.

Coal mining is huge. So is aggregates. There are thousands employed here by the various cement and aggregate companies. I would bet that sand, gravel and stone to support the heavy construction sector is much bigger than metals mining. 

Unless you work at the copper pit in Silver City there are no other mining jobs around here besides sand and gravel. There are several salt miners working at WIPP and the potash mines over by Carlsbad. There is a big perlite pit outside of Soccorro that employs A few dozen. A couple of coal mines supplying the big generation plants up by Farmington.

The uranium mines near Mt. Taylor shut down after the big disaster. They shut the big Chevron Molly mine down near Questa years ago and a few jobs lingered until the cleanup was completed. But not much metal mining here at all.

Lots of rock mining going on though. 

Just a hunch but a quick glance across the landscape and I see a lot more concrete than steel. It would make sense that rock and dirt probably produces much more revenue. 

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Here where i live we have several gold mines. In the county alone we have i believe 13. The whole state has 31 or so. Im not 100% sure, but the last numbers i heard on the royalties was 5 to 8 percent on the gross wasn't it?

Screenshot_20201024-184044_Chrome.jpg

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I know right!! Maybe i will too! Then i wont have to work because of the royalties, and i will be getting everything my rich neighbors have because of the socialism and a free phone has to be in the mix somewhere in there right?? Haha Democratic Party here i come!!! Haha jeez Bob you kill me.

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On 10/22/2020 at 2:40 PM, LukeJ said:

1% is 820 million that could be used to prop up the infrastructure that mining companies use to do business.  Roads, bridges, highways....etc.  I just made up a number.  It could even be less than 1% and still be very significant.

It's 'funny' the different perspectives displayed here.  I never once thought I would somehow get a 'royalty' check in the mail.  It seems obvious to me, since I don't want my personal income taxes raised to eventually pay for all the things that are now overdue for repairs.  The money has to come from somewhere.  What do you guys think about toll roads? :4chsmu1:

Weren't gas taxes supposed to be used to maintain and improve roads?  
I think the people from Alaska get a royalty check from oil produced in that state. 

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1 hour ago, Dakota Slim said:

Weren't gas taxes supposed to be used to maintain and improve roads?  
I think the people from Alaska get a royalty check from oil produced in that state. 

How's that going?  Should 'we' tax gas more?  How about diesel?  Pass it along to the consumer?

Yes, the people of Alaska get a check for $1606.  Alaska is a special place.

Have you ever lived in Alaska?

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