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46 minutes ago, LukeJ said:

I believe that's what they are finding all over the nation.

The people who are causing the chaos and anarchy don't even live in the communities they are attacking.

Organized crime, gangs, possible foreign organizations.....      They all have something to gain.

 

I just listened to a press conference and the Police Chief of Santa Monica said that over 400 were arrested and 95% were not from Santa Monica!

Santa Monica residents showed up to help clean up.  I might have done it too but we have a plumbing leak today.

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From my perspective, and the way I was taught in two different police academies and years of police work (under California law), A police officer (or a citizen) may not use deadly force solely in defe

Im gonna say i dont agree with all of the people saying the United States is full of inequality. I have 5 friends that are a "Minority" and they have awesome careers making over 100 grand a year. Coll

It would be one thing if you had a thick enough skin to see these topics through to the end. But no, you start them and then tattle when you don’t like others responses. That’s the equivalent of the l

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19 minutes ago, Morlock said:

We know the russians were using facebook before the last election to exploit racial divisions. Perhaps they are doing it again but only to inflame public opinions.

While it may not be a physical presence, it could certainly raise tensions.

They have been subversively undermining us for a long time now.

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3 hours ago, LukeJ said:

The way I see it, it's the small percentage of people in the crowd who are there to cause chaos and anarchy.  Not the majority.

I'm sure that guy in the picture above is a hardened criminal.  The one with the Fruit Loops and the baby formula. 

Stealing is wrong, but maybe his kids are hungry and he no longer has a job.  :arrowheadsmiley:

That's brilliant Luke.  

Edited by Dakota Slim
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5 hours ago, Dakota Slim said:

In broad daylight.

0000loot.jpg

I'm not implying anything about your age Luke, but could you please tell me how is it that you so readily recognized the Fruit Loops box in the photograph? :)

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21 minutes ago, BMc said:

I'm not implying anything about your age Luke, but could you please tell me how is it that you so readily recognized the Fruit Loops box in the photograph? :)

Well can't you see Toucan Sam there on the box?

I have kids and I do most of the grocery shopping around here.  :shhhhh:

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3 hours ago, Morlock said:

I agree. There's always a few bad apples on both sides that cause the problems. Bad cops and the thugs. Get rid of both and we wouldn't have these problems. But that's never going to happen and we'll continue to have these issues.

I agree Morlock. Bad cops and thugs come with the territory. No doubt. BUT, if communities -- especially large ones -- come up with a plan to limit protests to what is legal and institute tough law enforcement enforcement for anything that goes beyond the limit we will see fewer riots, less looting and less destruction of property. 
As a society, we can not accept what has happened over the last week. We owe it to ourselves and future generations to make this happen. We owe it to George Floyd. 

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, LukeJ said:

I have kids and I do most of the grocery shopping around here.  :shhhhh:

And one of the last things you would want to do to your kids is get busted and thrown in jail for looting a store, correct?

Edited by Dakota Slim
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14 minutes ago, Dakota Slim said:

And one of the last things you would want to do to your kids is get busted and thrown in jail for looking a store, correct?

I'd be willing to bet that my circumstance is vastly different than a man's who would loot a store for cereal and dry milk.

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I wonder what this guy has planned?

5ecfa15d988ee37d772e6305.jpg

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Posted (edited)
56 minutes ago, LukeJ said:

I'd be willing to bet that my circumstance is vastly different than a man's who would loot a store for cereal and dry milk.

Circumstances AND mindset Luke. 

Edited by Dakota Slim
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1 hour ago, Dakota Slim said:

I agree Morlock. Bad cops and thugs come with the territory. No doubt. BUT, if communities -- especially large ones -- come up with a plan to limit protests to what is legal and institute tough law enforcement enforcement for anything that goes beyond the limit we will see fewer riots, less looting and less destruction of property. 
As a society, we can not accept what has happened over the last week. We owe it to ourselves and future generations to make this happen. We owe it to George Floyd. 

We owe it to George Floyd to change the way we police and how we punish cops who abuse their authority.

Social unrest will stop when the people feel social change is happening.

The protests will slow down over the next few days. And the riots will lessen. But there will be acts of senseless violence in the future. And the same organized groups that are turning protests into chaos will do some stupid things. Individuals will do stupid things too.

This situation is here to stay until change happens. And the more violent and heavy handed the authorities are the worse it will get. 

We need social change a lot more than we need punishment for petty thievery from a store with open doors and broken windows. 

There is no excuse for criminal activity. But neither is there an excuse for sweeping systemic policing problems under the rug. Trying to focus on a poor man stealing a box of fruit loops in an attempt to distract from the horrific scene that started all of this is childish.

We are a nation of laws. A guy guilty of smashing a window is in a completely different category from a guy that would kill a handcuffed man while in a position of authority.

No one here has ever indicated that rioting and destruction of property is justified or should go unpunished. The issue is punishing the police that committed the horrific crime. That is why the protests continue. And as long as the protests continue there will be individuals take advantage of the situation for various reasons besides justice for George Floyd.

These big protests will fizzle out sooner or later.  The rioting will stop sooner than later. But our problems just begin when the looting and rioting stop. The next phase will be acts of violence. Against police, institutions, symbols and people. It will be carried out by the various factions that are causing the trouble in the streets now. 

Much of the public has lost trust in the police. They will never regain trust until there is justice for the acts of brutality and aggression that do regularly happen.

Communities know who the good cops are and who the bad cops are. So do the departments. It is time for the police in general to admit they have a problem and work with the community to fix them. When justice looks the same for a black man stealing fruit loops and a cop abusing his authority then our problems are lessened. 

Punish a few cops for the brutal crap they do and you won't have to worry about your fruit loops or your powdered milk. Nor will you worry about burning in the street or terrorist organizations taking advantage of a chaotic situation. We are all stronger when all men get the same justice and no one is above the law. 

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3 minutes ago, Dakota Slim said:

Circumstances AND mindset Luke. 

My mindset would be different if my kids were hungry.

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Posted (edited)
9 minutes ago, Bedrock Bob said:

We owe it to George Floyd to change the way we police and how we punish cops who abuse their authority.

Social unrest will stop when the people feel social change is happening.

The protests will slow down over the next few days. And the riots will lessen. But there will be acts of senseless violence in the future. And the same organized groups that are turning protests into chaos will do some stupid things.

This situation is here to stay until change happens. And the more violent and heavy handed the authorities are the worse it will get. 

We need social change a lot more than we need punishment for petty thievery from a store with open doors and broken windows. 

There is no excuse for criminal activity. But neither is there an excuse for sweeping systemic policing problems under the rug. Trying to focus on a poor man stealing a box of fruit loops in an attempt to distract from the horrific scene that started all of this is childish.

We are a nation of laws. A guy guilty of smashing a window is in a completely different category from a guy that would kill a man becauwe he wore a badge.

No one here has ever indicated that rioting and destruction of property is justified or should go unpunished. The issue is punishing the police that committed the horrific crime. That is why the protests continue. And as long as the protests continue there will be individuals take advantage of the situation for various reasons besides justice for George Floyd.

These big protests will fizzle out sooner or later.  The rioting will stop sooner than later. But our problems just begin when the looting and rioting stop. The next phase will be acts of violence. Against police, institutions, symbols and people. It will be carried out by the various factions that are causing the trouble in the streets now. 

Much of the public has lost trust in the police. They will never regain trust until there is justice for the acts of brutality and aggression that do regularly happen.

Communities know who the good cops are and who the bad cops are. So do the departments. It is time for the police in general to admit they have a problem and work with the community to fix them. When justice looks the same for a black man stealing fruit loops and a cop abusing his authority then our problems are lessened. 

Punish a few cops for the brutal crap they do and you won't have to worry about your fruit loops or your powdered milk. Nor will you worry about burning in the street or adversaries taking advantage of a chaotic situation. We are all stronger when all men get the same justice and no one is above the law. 

I disagree with much of that bh. Social unrest will never stop. 

Edited by Dakota Slim
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18 minutes ago, Dakota Slim said:

I disagree with much of that bh. Social unrest will never stop. 

Why do you think it will not stop Slim?

What parts do you agree with?

What do you disagree with?

Why?

Please explain!

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14 minutes ago, Dakota Slim said:

I disagree with much of that bh. Social unrest will never stop. 

With that attitude, you're right.

 

3 hours ago, Dakota Slim said:

No doubt there should be consequences for looting.  But why should we be so quick to toss a man in prison?

It costs roughly $30k a year to keep someone incarcerated.  While locked up, that person provides nothing to society.

I think the money would be better 'spent' (if we're going to spend it at all) over a longer period, while being used to 'give someone a hand up, not a hand out'.  Maybe somethings as simple as tax cuts, or education and job training.  Of course there'd have to be a number of good paying jobs, but that's different subject.

If more of 'these people' felt like they had even a tiny slice of the American pie, they might find themselves as the ones who are staying home and protecting their 'American Dreams'.

Maybe I'm just too much of an idealist?

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1 hour ago, Bedrock Bob said:

Why do you think it will not stop Slim?

What parts do you agree with?

What do you disagree with?

Why?

Please explain!

It's simple bh. The utopia you describe doesn't exist and it never will. 

 

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CORONER'S FINDING: Official finding by the Hennipin Co. Corner's office in the Floyd case is Homicide. (Death at the hands of another) That will be expert witness testimony in any trial against defendant(s) charged with Murder (unlawful killing of a human being) Theoretically rules out all other causes; accidental, natural, etc. Step one in backing up the DA's Murder 3/Man 2 filing.  

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1 hour ago, LukeJ said:

With that attitude, you're right.

 

No doubt there should be consequences for looting.  But why should we be so quick to toss a man in prison?

It costs roughly $30k a year to keep someone incarcerated.  While locked up, that person provides nothing to society.

I think the money would be better 'spent' (if we're going to spend it at all) over a longer period, while being used to 'give someone a hand up, not a hand out'.  Maybe somethings as simple as tax cuts, or education and job training.  Of course there'd have to be a number of good paying jobs, but that's different subject.

If more of 'these people' felt like they had even a tiny slice of the American pie, they might find themselves as the ones who are staying home and protecting their 'American Dreams'.

Maybe I'm just too much of an idealist?

Great ideas!

People just want to have equal opportunity.

A guaranteed two years of college or trade school is a minimum education these days and should be free at a State University.

Fixing the justice system is a huge undertaking but should be job number one. This is a major problem that has been neglected for years.

Placing an appropriate tax burden on the super rich and raising the minimum wage to a reasonable level would eliminate a bunch of problems.

And making basic health care a right and eliminating insurance companies from basic health needs is necessary too.

Good solutions have been suggested that will make a lot of difference in our sustainability and security as a country. The mega wealthy will have to foot the bill and they are spending mega bucks to keep these ideas from coming to fruition.

The virus, the economic situation and the social unrest will force big changes. It will be a conflict between classes and not races. That is becoming more evident each day and as this economic situation sinks in it will be even more clear.

We will either get equality or be ruled by the wealthy and powerful in a way that we have never seen. Before we get there we are going to have a lot of painful times.

I don't see any easy way out of this. My gut feeling is that life as we knew it before Jan. 1, 2020 will never be the same in many respects.

We have an election down the road. Just let your mind wander over how that will affect the three big issues facing the country today. There are only two options and both of them have some serious implications for social unrest, economic concerns and health issues. Neither have given much indication that they have a plan. Without leadership at the top the calculus gets funky and things slide sideways easily. I don't see any real solutions on the horizon.

Wash your hands. Wear a mask. Grow a garden. Love each other and your neighbors. Gather your loved ones close and position yourselves so you can best weather the storm that is yet to come. Because you haven't seen nothin' yet.

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Just curious. Does anyone know how many or if any of the convicts released from prison because of COVID were arrested during the riots? 
I know some others went on to commit additional crimes not related to the riots. 

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27 minutes ago, Dakota Slim said:

It's simple bh. The utopia you describe doesn't exist and it never will. 

 

I didn't describe a Utopia Slim.

 

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1 hour ago, LukeJ said:

With that attitude, you're right.

 

No doubt there should be consequences for looting.  But why should we be so quick to toss a man in prison?

It costs roughly $30k a year to keep someone incarcerated.  While locked up, that person provides nothing to society.

I think the money would be better 'spent' (if we're going to spend it at all) over a longer period, while being used to 'give someone a hand up, not a hand out'.  Maybe somethings as simple as tax cuts, or education and job training.  Of course there'd have to be a number of good paying jobs, but that's different subject.

If more of 'these people' felt like they had even a tiny slice of the American pie, they might find themselves as the ones who are staying home and protecting their 'American Dreams'.

Maybe I'm just too much of an idealist?

Socio-Economic deprivation has been used as an excuse for criminal behavior for many decades and billions of dollars has been thrown at it. There are more social welfare programs today than ever existed in any society in history. Even in the current food shortage situation, food banks and food sources are available to those in need that seek them out. Many very Liberal criminal justice system reforms instituted in recent years do not appear to decrease this type of social behavior either.

Given the opportunities and support systems available to those who seek them in this country, at some point, (long past), a civilized society has a right to expect it's members to transcend and rise above social conditions and perceived limitations, putting aside excuses, and be held accountable for their behavior. 

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5 minutes ago, Dakota Slim said:

Just curious. Does anyone know how many or if any of the convicts released from prison because of COVID were arrested during the riots? 
I know some others went on to commit additional crimes not related to the riots. 

What crimes did they commit? Where?

Can you back that up with any sources?

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