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4 minutes ago, Dakota Slim said:

When the rioting and looting is over. the fires have been put out and George Floyd's killer gets punished it will still be there folks....

That's because this problem is bigger and more complicated than the death of one man.

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From my perspective, and the way I was taught in two different police academies and years of police work (under California law), A police officer (or a citizen) may not use deadly force solely in defe

Im gonna say i dont agree with all of the people saying the United States is full of inequality. I have 5 friends that are a "Minority" and they have awesome careers making over 100 grand a year. Coll

It would be one thing if you had a thick enough skin to see these topics through to the end. But no, you start them and then tattle when you don’t like others responses. That’s the equivalent of the l

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2 minutes ago, LukeJ said:

That's because this problem is bigger than the death of one man.

Yep. That's why I titled this thread Riots, Looting and Arson and just mentioned those problems.
There's plenty of space to start another topic about other problems Luke. This is America.

 

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2 hours ago, Bedrock Bob said:

You are in some sort of fantasy land Mac. Your assumptions about me are as far off base as your assumptions about our society.

I'll let you know when I get mad, Hispanic or take a job as a social worker. Until then keep shooting in the dark. Maybe you will get lucky.

If anyone is butthurt about the description "pale white man" just let me know and I'll edit it. I wasnt trying to offend anyone. All you gotta do is ask me politely and tell me you would like me to change it.

It's just a discussion Mac. You aren't shaking anyone's world with your opinions. They line right up with the party line and we have heard them all before. I disagree with some and I agree with some. Wrestling with you over the part I disagree with is something I enjoy but not something that really makes much difference to me in the house of my day.

You can still pretend though. I can be whatever color you want to imagine. I can be a radical liberal if you want me to be. Or a revolutionary or a social worker. You can visualize me however you want. I don't mind at all.

If you want to know what reality is I'll tell you. But you will have to ask me politely. 

:)

I'm not making any assumptions about you Bob. I don't make assumptions. I do draw inferences based upon facts in evidence. I can make reasonable inferences and reach logical conclusions based on your posts. You, however; do seem to be making assumptions about me. And if you are making your assumptions based on my posts, then your assumptions are wrong, as assumptions tend to be. 

My views aren't fantasy Bob, and I don't consider your views as fantasy. We have different world views and we disagree on some things. We have different life experiences which influence our world view. Neither one of us grew up privileged or live in a Bubble of Privilege. You're wrong if you assumed that I did, except it is a great privilege to have been born in this country. If you are alluding to my race or ethnic background when you say I'm privileged and live in a bubble, then yes, some times being white may be an advantage. Other times, being a minority tends to have it's advantages. But I don't believe society judges us solely on race, and I have never lived in a "bubble". 

Personally, I wasn't offended by the "pale white man" remark. I was just trying to caution/remind you that this thread is being watched very closely, as you no doubt know. Heated discussions can get out of hand at times and threads do get shut down. That was the message.

Here's another area where you are mistaken: "You can still pretend though. I can be whatever color you want to imagine. I can be a radical liberal if you want me to be. Or a revolutionary or a social worker. You can visualize me however you want. I don't mind at all. If you want to know what reality is I'll tell you"

You seem to be expressing your reality already Bob, so no redundancy is required on my account. I have mine and you have yours. And I may know a little more about both than you give me credit for if you're basing yours on assumptions. 

I don't know why you keep trying on Cinderella's shoe Bob. If it doesnt fit you don't have to wear it. It sounds like either narcissism, or a persecution complex. Contrary to what you may have assumed, every post doesn't happen to have your name on it. They are directed, "To Whom It May Concern"

 

 

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58 minutes ago, LukeJ said:

You know much of what Bob described sounds like Germany.  Especially the education and healthcare.

They seem to be doing pretty good these days.

Oh yeah, and don't forget their race relations. They have a long "superior" history of that. 

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33 minutes ago, Dakota Slim said:

Yep. That's why I titled this thread Riots, Looting and Arson and just mentioned those problems.
There's plenty of space to start another topic about other problems Luke. This is America.

 

There's no need to start another topic.  My posts are on point.

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2 minutes ago, BMc said:

Oh yeah, and don't forget their race relations. They have a long "superior" history of that. 

I think they've put that largely behind them.

Which could be why they seem to be doing better than us these days.

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40 minutes ago, LukeJ said:

79469763_10157516471571094_2005114394194739200_o.jpg

And when free enterprise and capitalism is abolished, we can go back to hunting and gathering . . .

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2 minutes ago, LukeJ said:

I think they've put that largely behind them.

Which could be why they seem to be doing better than us these days.

I think maybe you are leaving out the immigration issue and a few other things . . .

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1 minute ago, BMc said:

And when free enterprise and capitalism is abolished, we can go back to hunting and gathering . . .

After years of 'record breaking' profits.  When will corporations take 'personal responsibility' and save some of their own money for a rainy day?

The economy is consumers.  If people don't have money, they can't consume.

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5 minutes ago, BMc said:

I think maybe you are leaving out the immigration issue and a few other things . . .

You mean this immigration issue?

Germany is the second most popular migration destination in the world, after the United States of America.[3] By UN estimates, as of 2017, 12,165,083 people living in Germany are immigrants, or about 14.8% of the German population.[4] The majority of immigrants in Germany are from Eastern Europe, Southern Europe and Middle East.

The German Government has been keen to encourage immigration over the past 50 years, to address the low birth rate in the country.[5]

On 1 January 2005, a new immigration law came into effect. The political background to this new law was that Germany, for the first time ever, was acknowledged to be a destination for immigrants. The practical changes[clarification needed] to immigration procedures were relatively minor. New immigration categories, such as "highly skilled professional" and "scientist" were introduced to attract valuable professionals to the German labour market. The development within German immigration law shows that immigration of skilled employees and academics has eased[clarification needed] while the labour market remains closed for unskilled workers.

In April 2012, European Blue Card legislation was implemented in Germany, allowing highly skilled non-EU citizens easier access to work and live in Germany, subject to certain requirements. According to the federal statistics office in 2016, over one out of five Germans has at least partial roots outside of the country.

 

What other things?

 

 

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3 minutes ago, LukeJ said:

You mean this immigration issue?

Germany is the second most popular migration destination in the world, after the United States of America.[3] By UN estimates, as of 2017, 12,165,083 people living in Germany are immigrants, or about 14.8% of the German population.[4] The majority of immigrants in Germany are from Eastern Europe, Southern Europe and Middle East.

The German Government has been keen to encourage immigration over the past 50 years, to address the low birth rate in the country.[5]

On 1 January 2005, a new immigration law came into effect. The political background to this new law was that Germany, for the first time ever, was acknowledged to be a destination for immigrants. The practical changes[clarification needed] to immigration procedures were relatively minor. New immigration categories, such as "highly skilled professional" and "scientist" were introduced to attract valuable professionals to the German labour market. The development within German immigration law shows that immigration of skilled employees and academics has eased[clarification needed] while the labour market remains closed for unskilled workers.

In April 2012, European Blue Card legislation was implemented in Germany, allowing highly skilled non-EU citizens easier access to work and live in Germany, subject to certain requirements. According to the federal statistics office in 2016, over one out of five Germans has at least partial roots outside of the country.

 

What other things?

 

 

That's the canned pr version Luke. I'm referring to the tremendous backlash over Muslim immigration. 

 Violent Backlash Against Migrants in Germany

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5 minutes ago, BMc said:

That's the canned pr version Luke. I'm referring to the tremendous backlash over Muslim immigration. 

 Violent Backlash Against Migrants in Germany

I brought up Germany to point out their education and healthcare systems.  In order to back up what Bob was trying to say.

I don't think Slim wants us turning this into an immigration debate.

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50 minutes ago, LukeJ said:

I brought up Germany to point out their education and healthcare systems.  In order to back up what Bob was trying to say.

I don't think Slim wants us turning this into an immigration debate.

Or about Germany and their education system, I would think . . . 

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3 hours ago, Bedrock Bob said:

The things I described are not Socialism.

A confiscatory tax policy and redistribution of wealth is as Socialist as it gets. 

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28 minutes ago, BMc said:

Or about Germany and their education system, I would think . . . 

Yeah, but that backs up what I was saying about coming up with a plan to help get some of these people out of a rut.

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42 minutes ago, BMc said:

A confiscatory tax policy and redistribution of wealth is as Socialist as it gets. 

I dont support a "confiscatory" tax policy nor a redistribution of wealth.

Nor do I support Socialism.

I do support a living minimum wage and I do expect the super rich to pay their fair share in taxes.

I also support a reasonable universal health care program that covers basic needs for everyone. As well as funding to provide minimum education.

None of that is anywhere close to Socialism. But then you know that. You just want to argue. And call me a "Socialist". 

It is you trying on shoes you think might look good on me. None of them fit so far. I prefer something a little more butch but if you like to imagine me a Latino social worker in golden slippers let your freak run wild.

 

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4 hours ago, BMc said:

Socialism is not the answer. It's been repeatedly tried all over the world and failed. People cannot be made equal by destroying the country's economic system. There will always be economic disparity, no matter who is "at the top" because it's not about the money. Not even close.

"A guaranteed two years of college or trade school is a minimum education these days and should be free at a State University"

I would be for a version of this proposal, except the States can't afford it anymore. Especially the undocumented immigrant sanctuary states that chose to spend their money, including federal funding, on various social services programs to support illegal immigrants. Cool. But you pay your money and you make your choices. 

 

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3 minutes ago, Bedrock Bob said:

I dont support a confiscation tax policy nor a redistribution of wealth.

Funnier by the minute . . .

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4 hours ago, BMc said:

That may be the good news but that finding will no doubt come under attack by experts from the defense side. Pathologist Baden, who reportedly is helping Floyd's family, may be the tie breaker, if it came to that, because he will likely be the most credible witness.

News reports also allegedly indicated that the cause of death of Mr. Floyd involved, "other significant conditions" including, heart disease, hypertension, and listed fentanyl intoxication and recent methamphetamine use , although those factors were not listed under cause of death.

"Now we know why Baden was called in. He is a bought and paid for "professional witness" and the allegation by the defense will likely be that Baden was paid to "stack the deck" 

Reasonable doubt?

 

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7 minutes ago, BMc said:

News reports also allegedly indicated that the cause of death of Mr. Floyd involved, "other significant conditions" including, heart disease, hypertension, and listed fentanyl intoxication and recent methamphetamine use , although those factors were not listed under cause of death.

 

Fake news.

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4 minutes ago, BMc said:

News reports also allegedly indicated that the cause of death of Mr. Floyd involved, "other significant conditions" including, heart disease, hypertension, and listed fentanyl intoxication and recent methamphetamine use , although those factors were not listed under cause of death.

"Now we know why Baden was called in. He is a bought and paid for "professional witness" and the allegation by the defense will likely be that Baden was paid to "stack the deck" 

Reasonable doubt?

 

I don't think so. Not after kneeling for 8 minutes and 46 seconds on the man's neck.

It is just a tactic to try and take the focus off of what that cop did to this man. He killed him. He knelt on him until he was sure he was dead. Three others stood beside him and let it happen.

The cop murdered him plain and simple. Like so many others for so many years.Time to fix the problem and call this exactly what it is.

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6 minutes ago, LukeJ said:

Fake news.

Are you sure? I'm willing to accept that Luke, if it's true. And I take you at your word. I was looking at a news report that had quotation marks around it, so I'm not saying it's gospel. Is there any source that would refute that, you would care to share?

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7 minutes ago, Bedrock Bob said:

I don't think so. Not after kneeling for 8 minutes and 46 seconds on the man's neck.

It is just a tactic to try and take the focus off of what that cop did to this man. He killed him. He knelt on him until he was sure he was dead. Three others stood beside him and let it happen.

The cop murdered him plain and simple. Like so many others for so many years.Time to fix the problem and call this exactly what it is.

God, I wish life was as simple as you try to make it. And you talk to me about living in a bubble ?, Oy Vey! 

Where does a search for the truth come in? If you don't find it before the other side does, it will come back to bite you in the butt every time. 

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2 minutes ago, BMc said:

Are you sure? I'm willing to accept that Luke, if it's true. And I take you at your word. I was looking at a news report that had quotation marks around it, so I'm not saying it's gospel. Is there any source that would refute that, you would care to share?

No.  I just thought I'd repeat a term that has been popularized these last few years.

It doesn't matter how true a statement might be, once 'Fake news' has been proclaimed.

It's the flip side of the coin.

Why would you post anything you weren't sure was true?

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