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Jake7291

May have stumbled upon a meteorite

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I live in the thumb of Michigan on an old farm with over 80 acres of fields that get plowed yearly. Over the years on this property relatives would collect decent sized stones for rock gardens. One of the stones happened to stick out to me as it was rusting. I rock polish and stone carve so I wanted to take a look at it. I cracked the stone, I know I shouldn't have, and began working on a piece. My Dremel couldn't touch it and when I took an angle grinder to it, it began to melt and streak like steel. I stopped carving and decided to polish it instead, I will include the photos of the polished piece, and the raw form. I also tested it with a magnet, well a fridge magnet, and it stuck. 
I appreciate you taking the time to read through this and I hope this isn't a waste of your time. If you need better photos let me know please

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Ahh man I was hoping with that with the chondrules, it was a good chance at being one.  Every section on this thing is magnetic too.  There are a lot of stress or shock fractures all over the surface too.

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2 hours ago, Jake7291 said:

Ahh man I was hoping with that with the chondrules, it was a good chance at being one.  Every section on this thing is magnetic too.  There are a lot of stress or shock fractures all over the surface too.

If it is magnetic and earthly it should leave a streak. What color is it?

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4 minutes ago, Bedrock Bob said:

If it is magnetic and earthly it should leave a streak. What color is it?

It leaves a faint grey mark on porcelain (the only thing I had to scratch on right now is the back of my toilet tank lid)

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1 hour ago, Jake7291 said:

It leaves a faint grey mark on porcelain (the only thing I had to scratch on right now is the back of my toilet tank lid)

 

If it streaks grey its magnetite. A terrestrial iron.

Does it have any visible metal anywhere?

When you determine the state of the iron that is attracting the magnet you will have identified the stone. It is either mineral or metal. If it leaves a grey streak it is mineral. If it leaves a metallic streak it is free metal. Your stone streaks grey indicating mineral iron. That indicates it is a terrestrial stone.  Free metal would warrant a closer look. 

If it is super hard it won't streak easily and be fainter. Still if it is hues of red or grey it is terrestrial. Most of the time terrestrial iron is not very hard though. If the material is that hard you will be able to tell quickly whether it is metallic or sub metallic. It will either polish to a shiny metal or polish to a sub-metallic mineral. The cuttings will either be grey or they will be metallic. 

When you determine whether you have free metal or mineral attracting the magnet you will have your answer.

Bob

 

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I'll take some pictures of the streak tomorrow, I'm not too sure what you mean by metallic streak.  There are pieces inside it that look copper in color.  I hit a couple spots with a grinder before I polished a piece, and they would turn silver.  These fragments I have are very hard and sharp, attract magnets but not any other metal

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1 hour ago, Jake7291 said:

I'll take some pictures of the streak tomorrow, I'm not too sure what you mean by metallic streak.  There are pieces inside it that look copper in color.  I hit a couple spots with a grinder before I polished a piece, and they would turn silver.  These fragments I have are very hard and sharp, attract magnets but not any other metal

A metallic streak is metallic. Just like metal filings. Not a streak color like mineral iron. You can look in the window you ground and you will see free metallic iron or mineral iron. 

The only thing we are after is determining what state the iron in the rock is. We know it has iron if it sticks to a magnet. And it is a simple observation to find out if that metal is mineral or metallic. If it is mineral it is a terrestrial rock. If it is metallic it warrants further investigation.

If you can break it into little pieces and a magnet attracts those little pieces then you are looking at the iron. If you don't see shiny bits of free metallic iron then it is a mineral and not a meteorite. 

Magnetite is hard and it takes a good polish. It is "silver"... kinda. But it is sub-metallic. It is not shiny silver metal like steel. It is black metal. More like graphite. And the streak is grey. Not metallic.

Magnetite is the iron in your rock that is attracting a magnet. A terrestrial mineral. 

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I don't see anything in the photos to indicate it's a meteorite.

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Thank you to those that have responded.  I am very new to identification methods on stones, and appreciate all the info.  There are a few curios stones on the property and I'm sure I'll be posting again soon. 

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Quick update on this.  I was messing with my polished piece today and was checking it with a strong magnet again.  Strangely it is no longer magnetic, and neither are the smaller chunks that I have.  Is this normal for magnetite?

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On 9/11/2019 at 3:28 PM, Jake7291 said:

Ahh man I was hoping with that with the chondrules, it was a good chance at being one.  Every section on this thing is magnetic too.  There are a lot of stress or shock fractures all over the surface too.

check out different country records in the thumb area, especially october 1871, fires caused by meteorites.

2013 there were thosands of reports, today just a few. know why but don't want make your post into political riot.

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7 minutes ago, wet/dry washer said:

check out different country records in the thumb area, especially october 1871, fires caused by meteorites.

2013 there were thosands of reports, today just a few. know why but don't want make your post into political riot.

I also believe the fires of 1871 were started by meteorite.  I have done a little research into it and they found a 26 kilo meteorite in Port sanilac not too long ago that is believed to be one that started the burn.  I live in sanilac county just 3 miles from lake Huron

Link to an interesting read /www.angelfire.com/mi2/gfmeteor/evidence.htm

Edited by Jake7291
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thanks for posting angelfire, three articles remain on Google plus a couple of mine from nugget shooter 2013, where me received a blast of hot air BS from certain members on this forum. thanks for the memories.

me lobo and equinox 800 detectors when in all mental will not sound off on these asteroite fall rocks. some will move a compass but ones hotter than 1600 degrees when landing will not.

how do me know this? have done me own heat treating of air, oil, and water tool steals. they have be heated to over 1600 degrees when they loose there magnetism before quenching. air hard at 2000 degrees.

many do not have magnetic fields. looks like me out of luck finding the ones that are buried.

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8 hours ago, Jake7291 said:

I also believe the fires of 1871 were started by meteorite.  I have done a little research into it and they found a 26 kilo meteorite in Port sanilac not too long ago that is believed to be one that started the burn.  I live in sanilac county just 3 miles from lake Huron

Link to an interesting read /www.angelfire.com/mi2/gfmeteor/evidence.htm

The Chicago fires of 1871 were NOT started by meteorites. This is nothing but a myth perpetuated by people who believe in fantasies. Anyone who looks objectively at the historical records will come to the same conclusion.

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1 hour ago, Morlock said:

The Chicago fires of 1871 were NOT started by meteorites. This is nothing but a myth perpetuated by people who believe in fantasies. Anyone who looks objectively at the historical records will come to the same conclusion.

Even though fires broke out in Chicago at the same time, ok, guess it was that cow that knocked a lamp over in a barn.  Look at that link, check that ballistics pattern of fires that started, at the exact same time.

Edit: just wanted to add, not even ten years after these fires, an even greater fire broke out.  This fire nearly destroyed the entire thumb, this fire however was caused by dry seasons and a drought.  These two fires were not similar, in 1871 there was no smoke reported before seeing the fires, in 1881 there was.  I don't think 1871's fire was caused by a dry spell and heat like they say, it would have been more devastating

Edited by Jake7291

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3 hours ago, wet/dry washer said:

thanks for posting angelfire, three articles remain on Google plus a couple of mine from nugget shooter 2013, where me received a blast of hot air BS from certain members on this forum. thanks for the memories.

me lobo and equinox 800 detectors when in all mental will not sound off on these asteroite fall rocks. some will move a compass but ones hotter than 1600 degrees when landing will not.

how do me know this? have done me own heat treating of air, oil, and water tool steals. they have be heated to over 1600 degrees when they loose there magnetism before quenching. air hard at 2000 degrees.

many do not have magnetic fields. looks like me out of luck finding the ones that are buried.

Yes!  Magnetic material loses it's magnetism after being heated up, and it doesn't even take that much heat. There are.  There is overwhelming evidence of it being meteors in 1871.  In fact there are countless journal entries found in old surviving farm houses that describe seeing great balls fall from the sky and ground shaking explosions just moments before the fires.  I'll search through the journals in this house and ask around, my house survived the great fire it's been here since the French settlers of 1700s

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Your metal detector will not "sound off" on your "fall rocks" because they are ferric mineral and not metallic iron. That is how metal detectors work. You can however adjust the balance where they will "clench" the threshold and then overshoot.

You guys need to learn the difference between magnetism and being attracted by a magnet. Two different physical properties.

Meteorites do not get hot. They only spend a few short seconds exposed to friction and then a couple minutes in dark flight before they land. There is absolutely no way an object could get hot past the surface. You could not get one hot in a blast furnace in the short time they are exposed to friction.

When ignorance becomes equal to knowledge things get a bit curly. Anyone who has bizarre ideas that fly in the face of science and physics should at least respect others who have spent the time and effort to actually learn their stuff.

Just sayin boys. Alice in Wonderland is a great story but it gets a bit strange when you insist the golden slippers are real.

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I

18 minutes ago, Bedrock Bob said:

Your metal detector will not "sound off" on your "fall rocks" because they are ferric mineral an not native metallic iron. That is hoe metal detectors work. You can however adjust the balance where they will "clench" the threshold.

You guys need to learn the difference between magnetism and being attracted by a magnet. Two different physical properties.

Meteorites do not get hot. They only spend a few short seconds exposed to friction and then a couple minutes in dark flight before they land. There is absolutely no way an object could get hot past the surface. You could not get one hot in a blast furnace in the short time they are exposed to friction.

When ignorance becomes equal to knowledge things get a bit curly. Anyone who has bizarre ideas that fly in the face of science and physics should at least respect others who have spent the time nd effort to actually learn their stuff.

Just sayin boys. Alice in Wonderland is fine but it gets a bit strange when you insist the golden slippers are real.

I didn't realize this was a closed minded forum.  These meteorites happened to be a part of a comet, we were passing through the tail at the time.  The comet SPLIT, and all throught the U.S, not just Chicago and Michigan, fires broke out with no smoke nearly simultaneously.  Comets have methane, the meteorites crashing down could have contained the gas which burned the ground beneath it

Edit: I am not saying my stone is meteorite, I know it isn't, I have no crust.  I am no talking about the possibility of multiple meteorites around sanilac county after the discovery of a 26 kilo meteorite that may have started the fires in Michigan

Edited by Jake7291
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28 minutes ago, Jake7291 said:

I didn't realize this was a closed minded forum.  

This is a fact based forum. With a whole bunch of very experienced, very knowledgeable guys that know a whole bunch about meteorites and the physics involved.

And a few crackpots who are allowed to post some really strange ideas that fly in the face of physics.

You can "believe" whatever you want. But if you want to learn the real scoop about meteorites then you will need to leave the imaginary facts at the door. That isn't being "closed minded". That is just the difference between fantasy and reality.

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mother nature caused the meteorites to set the lumber on fire, making two natives very happy so they could find the fall rocks in the 324 sq mile smoke tree area California.

 

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1 hour ago, wet/dry washer said:

mother nature caused the meteorites to set the lumber on fire, making two natives very happy so they could find the fall rocks in the 324 sq mile smoke tree area California.

 

The natives seem to be having trouble convincing ANYONE that what they found is meteoritic. Objective reasoning and physical examination shows that they are obviously not. The only disconnect is between your ears.

Your rocks are terrestrial oxidized iron. You have proven this over and over. You can believe whatever you want to believe. You can repeat it over and over. But that won't turn those rocks into meteorites. It will however make logical people wonder about your thought processes and mental state.

Insisting hematite is meteoritic is boring bob. We have fellows here that actually find meteorites and have reality based discussions on the subject. We have guys with the knowledge that could help you find a meteorite. Your bizarre ideas that you cling to are the only thing that keeps you from being a real meteorite hunter. 

Honestly bob! You re a good guy and people here like you. You re a kind soul and we respect your "beliefs" despite the fact that we know better. You are free to post whatever you want. But when it diverges so far from reality you must expect someone to come along and tell it like it is. 

Some people come her to learn. For those we must lay reality next to the fantasy.

Others come here to post cockamamy crap to experienced prospectors. Those fellows should expect to be called out on it. That just comes with the territory. 

Mother nature plays by the rules of physics. That is what she is. Real prospectors must deal with the cold hard facts of reality. Prospectors who substitute facts with fantasy find nothing. 

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6 hours ago, Bedrock Bob said:

Your metal detector will not "sound off" on your "fall rocks" because they are ferric mineral and not metallic iron. That is how metal detectors work. You can however adjust the balance where they will "clench" the threshold and then overshoot.

You guys need to learn the difference between magnetism and being attracted by a magnet. Two different physical properties.

Meteorites do not get hot. They only spend a few short seconds exposed to friction and then a couple minutes in dark flight before they land. There is absolutely no way an object could get hot past the surface. You could not get one hot in a blast furnace in the short time they are exposed to friction.

When ignorance becomes equal to knowledge things get a bit curly. Anyone who has bizarre ideas that fly in the face of science and physics should at least respect others who have spent the time and effort to actually learn their stuff.

Just sayin boys. Alice in Wonderland is a great story but it gets a bit strange when you insist the golden slippers are real.

Meteorites don't get hot? Care to explain why challenger burned up in the atmosphere? Probably the rumor that objects don't get hot in the atmosphere? Meteorites have been known to boil by cameras watching rocks strapped to the hull of a craft upon re-entry Besides, this looks nothing like a meteorite, it has linear flow features, there doesn't  seem to be any orientation either.

Edited by WillM

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2 hours ago, WillM said:

Meteorites don't get hot? Care to explain why challenger burned up in the atmosphere? Probably the rumor that objects don't get hot in the atmosphere? Meteorites have been known to boil by cameras watching rocks strapped to the hull of a craft upon re-entry Besides, this looks nothing like a meteorite, it has linear flow features, there doesn't  seem to be any orientation either.

WillM,

You need to show respect for experience or I am not going to talk to you. 

I worked for NASA/JSC when the Challenger failed. I worked at the site that builds and tests the components for the shuttle as well as defense hardware. We put lots of stuff in space and examined what came down.

I was on the Challenger recovery team and found many pounds of the debris. I was involved in the CAIB report and hunted the strewn field for three months.

Challenger did not burn up in the atmosphere. The Shuttle failed because the heat shield tiles came off from spots on the vehicle. The vehicle did not get hot. When the tiles came off and exposed the structure it blew a hole in it. The thin aeroframe ablated because the heat shields stripped off. It destroyed control systems and lost aerodynamics. The craft tumbled and came apart.

Some of the pieces that were exposed to friction upon reentry had burned surfaces. But the interior was unchanged. Even aluminum parts had burned skin but did not change shape. Titanium parts that had burned skin on one side and no bluing at the other end. There were parts spread out from Colorado to Texas and none showed heating at the core of the mass. Only on the surface. Most were undamaged by heat as the craft decelerated almost instantly upon coming apart. Exactly like a meteorite does.

Friction is much different than radiant or conductive heat. And stones are only exposed to friction for a few seconds. This heats only the very surface and the hot material strips away quickly. There is no radiant heat and very little chance for conductive heat to penetrate. As a result the stone remains cool even if the surface is being stripped away.

It is the same principal that cools a sawblade. The heat is carried away with the wood chips and the blade tips stay cool.

The physics of re-entry is well known. How the heat shield tiles work and the reason meteorites don't get hot is relatively simple. I realize that you don't understand it and you don't have the basic knowledge to truly rationalize why this happens. But you are going to have to accept the fact that is how it works. We bring space vehicles out of orbit every day and have nearly a century of observations to back up the math. 

Your snotty question shows you lack respect for knowledge and experience. You need to figure out that you are WAY over your head here. If you want me to discuss these topics with you then you will need to pose your questions with respect. Otherwise you can get your education "organically".

Bob

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