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Bedrockbob contact? Glorieta

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3 hours ago, Bedrock Bob said:

Once you have had the experiences that we have had then you will understand the humor.

I hate to tell you but your specimen is not a Glorieta. 

You asked for an inroad to Glorieta and I gave you sound advice instead. I'm sorry it was not what you wanted or expected. But it is as good as you are going to get.

The shortest route to success in this hobby is the route I laid out in my post. If you want to scour the ground in the NF somewhere for a Glorieta you can do that but I can assure you it will only make you see the humor in our posts more clearly. It will not, however yield any meteorites. 

Good luck Mr. Ice.

Fair enough. I am planning on going to the sites you mentioned, though may not get to them in that order. Just curious though, is there anything in particular that makes you so sure the fragment is not part of Glorieta (apart from being outside the accepted strewn field)? It is only a small fragment.

Thanks.

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6 minutes ago, lceman said:

Fair enough. I am planning on going to the sites you mentioned, though may not get to them in that order. Just curious though, is there anything in particular that makes you so sure the fragment is not part of Glorieta (apart from being outside the accepted strewn field)? It is only a small fragment.

Thanks.

It just does not look anything like a Glorieta. They are not hard to identify. Even the little tiny ones. 

Glorieta has a black/blue crust and is very sculpted. The rust is thin and several shades darker than terrestrial trash. Not bright like your piece. It is generally not corroded too badly and never has a shaley exterior like yours with little granules of sand stuck to the corrosion. If you see granules involved they are little shards of olivine.

It is rounded, smooth, hard and heavy. And the smaller the pieces the more rounded little blebs and drops they are. They just don't look like tramp metal at all. They look more like blued BBs with irregular shapes.

I have found a semi truck full of tramp metal and every piece looks like yours. I have found a shoe box full of Glorieta and not a single piece looks like yours. That coupled with the fact that the odds of you finding one without knowing exactly where to look are almost zero. That is what makes me sure.

This is just my opinion though and the best explanation that I can offer you. If SEM tells you this matches the metallurgical profile of Glorieta then you can wave it in the air and proclaim that you have found one. I'm sure not going to argue with you and I will still buy you that beer. But you will have a hard time convincing anyone who is familiar with Glorieta because it just does not look anything like the material I have found or seen.

 

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1 hour ago, FlakMagnet said:

Bob, what does his specimen look like?

 

Tramp metal of some sort.

Free metallic iron can only be tramp metal or a meteorite. Those are the only two choices that are possible. His is some type of metal artifact.

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Here are some small Glorietas for you to compare yours with.

 

DSCN0373.JPG

 

If you find anything that looks like this I owe you some beers. I honestly hope you cash in on that offer.

 

 

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3 hours ago, FlakMagnet said:

Tramp metal...Do you mean something like slag? Or...?

 

You might find slag around the railroad, an old mining operation or somewhere they were welding but I am talking about just bits of torn metal. You find lots of pieces of metal in the woods. Mostly chunks of striking tools, axes and splitting wedges. Chain links, points of tools, teeth from trenchers, metal from vehicles, etc. etc.

Anywhere around Santa Fe you have the old trails, the railroad, the highway, and all the wood cutting, farming and ranching operations. Then there was a running battle there that lasted several days and covered many square miles of mountains. Lots of schrapnel was produced. So you hit a lot of little chunks of tramp metal without much form. Some are broken and twisted from the original piece and some are just rusted away to formless blobs. 

All of that is suspect meteorites before you finally find one. Then all of that goes in the trash and you can settle down to the business at hand.

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5 hours ago, Bedrock Bob said:

You might find slag around the railroad, an old mining operation or somewhere they were welding but I am talking about just bits of torn metal. You find lots of pieces of metal in the woods. Mostly chunks of striking tools, axes and splitting wedges. Chain links, points of tools, teeth from trenchers, metal from vehicles, etc. etc.

Anywhere around Santa Fe you have the old trails, the railroad, the highway, and all the wood cutting, farming and ranching operations. Then there was a running battle there that lasted several days and covered many square miles of mountains. Lots of schrapnel was produced. So you hit a lot of little chunks of tramp metal without much form. Some are broken and twisted from the original piece and some are just rusted away to formless blobs. 

All of that is suspect meteorites before you finally find one. Then all of that goes in the trash and you can settle down to the business at hand.

Any of that battle in NF? It's been almost 30 years since I studied Sibley's calamity.

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3 hours ago, Edge said:

Any of that battle in NF? It's been almost 30 years since I studied Sibley's calamity.

The "battle" covered a lot of ground for several days between the villages of Rowe and Canoncito on both sides of the pass. There are two recognized "battlefields" that are monuments and several private ranches figured into the equation too. No doubt there was action on NF land somewhere.

All that NF land is heavily wooded foothills on the flank of Glorieta peak or way up on top of Glorieta Mesa. There is precious little NF land that an army could maneuver horses, cannons and stuff  on. Out there in the NF land in heavy woods with steep slopes would be a poor place to be and it is my guess there was very little fighting on what is now NF land. The battle happened on what is now downtown Pecos and the Glorieta residential lots and small ranches.

I am not sure what difference the land status makes. You could not legally hunt artifacts on NF land any more than on the monuments. And it is not difficult to access private land where you could hunt them. As a matter of fact there is private land and a shrine to the battle just off the highway in the pass where you could access one of the main battlefields. A fellow named Al Sanchez owned it and he encouraged guys to hunt there. Al is passed and the status of that land may be different now, but to the best of my knowledge you can still hunt there.

There is a cannon sticking out of a gravel bench on Al's property. You can walk down a trail and down the creek a bit and take a peek at it. Lots of other neat finds made there too. There is (was) a "caretaker" that lived there and would tell the stories to anyone who would listen.

Since the battle covered many miles there is lots of opportunities to hunt on corporate, state and other "non residential" private land with little consequence. And then there are several big private ranches where a fellow could easily get permission to hunt. 

NF land, monument land, and private land with no permission is the land you CANT hunt civil war artifacts on. But that represents only a small fraction of the potential battlefield. There are several big pueblo complexes that are cultural sites and a whole bunch of historic buildings that would be off limits too.

The battlefield is not the big hunt there. Nor is the meteorite. This area is the Santa Fe trail and where the Spanish taxed the wagons. It is where the Comanche fought the Spanish and then served as their security. It was the place where the Genizaros became farmers and blacksmiths and created the first Spanish colonies. It was where the cowboys drove the cattle to load them on the train.

There are silver coins, religious artifacts and Milagros buried on every peak and under every tree. There are old graves, descansos, moradas and ancient villages everywhere. Old outposts, Spanish pajares and cowboy camps everywhere. Railroad artifacts and wagon train stuff. Route 66 sites with hundreds of old filling stations and tourist trap sites. Then there is Santa Fe itself which is an urban treasure hunter's dream. That is where the diamonds are at!

There is so much good stuff to be found around here it is amazing. And the possibilities for getting an exclusive on a good dig is real. Meteorites not so much.

 

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mike miller in kingmen has hunted glorieta, there is two types of glorieta's, siderite and pallasite, which he found a 25 pounder.

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Mike Miller found the 300lb main mass!  Don't overlook that one. :ROFL:

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19 hours ago, Bedrock Bob said:

Here are some small Glorietas for you to compare yours with.

 

 

Are those your finds, Bob?  Very pretty!

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1 hour ago, Mikestang said:

Mike Miller found the 300lb main mass!  Don't overlook that one. :ROFL:

me was only reffering to the one trip that he made where he and his friend dug it up. as mike was digging his friend bet him $20 it was not a meteorite. mike won.

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