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chrisski

Thoughts on Claim

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I almost went to this claim, but I think I'm going to skip it.  Not good Geology. But thoughts?

It's located to the West of the White Tanks, very flat, with nothing resembling hills for miles.  Appears to be the same as the Phoenix Valley where you'd expect to get 2000 feet of valley fill before bedrock.  Nothing resembling bedrock on Google Maps.  Geology is sands and gravels from the Qm (Middle to Late Pleistocene) and Qy (Holocene), so all recent (Quatiary) deposits of gravels for miles, so about 1 million to 10,000 years old  Also, this club claim is the only active claim for miles.  There is pre-Cambrian rocks, but that is miles away.  Does not look like the shallow bedrock I want for a detector.  Also, I can't seem to pull down the USGS maps I keep getting "Link Not Available."

All these are bad indicators, but the club write up says fines to small nuggets.  It is located by the vulture mine, but the geology is much different.

I think I'm choosing good by skipping this club claim.

Edited by chrisski

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Instead of the claim I mentioned at my last post, I did some research into an open 20 acres be the San Domingo and went out there today.  I planned two ways in: one by walking a 300' elevation change, and the other driving a trail. Turned out the trail was a no go for the truck, so I walked in.  I heard voices as soon as I entered, and at first I thought someone was I the valley by my truck, but it turned out to be the claim adjacent to the one I was being worked.  I talked to the guys, and one had just bought the claim, and swore the area I had wanted to work was claimed. 

In case my research had been wrong, I did not want to High Grade.  Even with LR2000 working, which I can't get it to since the BLM changed the website, the old LR2000 had a 2 week delay after someone had mailed the claim before it entered the database.  Finding a new monument in an unfamiliar area is like finding a needle in a haystack.  With line of sight limited by vegetation and hills, you may need to walk the whole claim if the paperwork is not located at a corner.

I went to a club claim and it looked like it had been worked to death.  Turns out that the Maricopa Group of GPAA claims is a bit small for me, so I will continue to look for a new claim.

Adventure will continue next week for a new spot.

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Most of the club claims have been hammered pretty hard. You can still squeak some yellar out of them but the pickens are slim. Further back off the beaten path will probably increase your chance of scoring better AU. It's sure not like it was 30 years ago...a lot of gravy back then.  Jim

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I am trying to come up with an off the beaten path that will be a three or four day trip.  Might be one in December and one in the summer.

I tried an area quite a few miles south of Lynx creek.  Wasn't Lynx creek but was part of the national forest.  This was pretty remote, but still someone had beat me to it a few days before me.  They had dug a 2' deep hole in the unnamed creek down to bedrock.  I found nothing worth mentioning in the area.  Fun looking though.

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5 hours ago, chrisski said:

This was pretty remote, but still someone had beat me to it a few days before me.  They had dug a 2' deep hole in the unnamed creek down to bedrock. 

Then it was not remotely remote.

You do not need a claim just to go camp and prospect for 8 days a year. Plenty of open BLM and Forest service land for that

Edited by adam
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16 hours ago, chrisski said:

Instead of the claim I mentioned at my last post, I did some research into an open 20 acres be the San Domingo and went out there today.  I planned two ways in: one by walking a 300' elevation change, and the other driving a trail. Turned out the trail was a no go for the truck, so I walked in.  I heard voices as soon as I entered, and at first I thought someone was I the valley by my truck, but it turned out to be the claim adjacent to the one I was being worked.  I talked to the guys, and one had just bought the claim, and swore the area I had wanted to work was claimed. 

 

  The last time I was challenged about being on someones claim, I happily pulled out my topo map and showed them where they were...then informed them they were standing on private property  (owned by Sierra Pacific) which I had permission to dredge on...if those people were so adamant about that land being claimed, SURELY they could have shown or told you where the discovery monument and corner markers were???  How is a person supposed to know/prospect an area if the local claims aren't "CLEARLY MARKED"??? Run to the local BLM???  Is that what people did over a hundred years ago when the mining laws were written?

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On 10/29/2017 at 6:11 PM, chrisski said:

I am trying to come up with an off the beaten path that will be a three or four day trip.  Might be one in December and one in the summer.

I tried an area quite a few miles south of Lynx creek.  Wasn't Lynx creek but was part of the national forest.  This was pretty remote, but still someone had beat me to it a few days before me.  They had dug a 2' deep hole in the unnamed creek down to bedrock.  I found nothing worth mentioning in the area.  Fun looking though.

I think your thinking you need a claim further away, as in a day or more away, is un-necessary.. I know here you're talking about staying out 3 - 4 days; I'm including something you've mentioned in the past as well..

I totally understand your thinking when you say a three or so hour drive to "on the gold" is the same thing all the other day trippers are looking for as well, thereby making wherever you're heading feel over-run.. The thing is, regardless where you head, regardless how near or far, that same situation exists..

I think the saying goes: You don't leave gold to search for gold.. And there's still plenty of gold within easy striking distance of your home-20..

It's easy to fall into the bleakness pit if one dwells on how long prior to now locations have been worked.. Yeah, almost all the easy surface nugget pickin's are gone.. But so what..? There's still scads of smaller pieces-parts all throughout your region.. Not only that but there are still locations where larger nuggets / speci are being found, and those prizes are not sitting on bedrock..

It isn't about how heavily a location has been worked, it's about how deep it's been worked.. I think you may be able to find a spot or two between, ohhh, let's say Wickenburg - Prescott where if you could peel away the top 20" it'd be like starting anew, and that doesn't take into account some fines and flakes still hanging around up top.. That's what/where you want to find and claim.. All you need to do is find one of those outcroppings that terminate three feet down.. Ezy-pzy.. :thumbsupanim

Swamp

Edited by Swampstomper Al
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Hey Chrisski,

I know how you feel until I got spooled up on geology I used to travel hours from my house to detect/drywash. What I've really learned lately is spend the time at spots close to home. By hitting the spots close to home I've been able to spend more time in the field than driving and also learn the geology better. I'm now at the point that I'm finding gold regularly both detecting and dry washing. The areas I've been working are "hammered" oldtimer workings and I really think my success is linked to having more time to work the area and getting to know the local geology better. I grew up spending tons of time in the Bradshaws and know there are areas off the beaten path that probably hasn't seen a detector but have been worked way back in the day.  Since you are in Phoenix I'd spend my time in the southern Bradshaws in a area between LSD and Tip Top. There is allot of awesome open ground that you have to back pack to that may be killer for detecting. Also there is geology similar to the Bradshaws east of I17 on the other side of the basalt cap. Lots of pinal shist with quartz intrusions that need to be explored out there. And lastly there are some awesome areas north of Black Canyon City that you can back pack into that have some nice hanging benches. 

DP

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I an eyeing some of the areas you mentioned between tip top and LSD.  I did notice the AZ Geology maps have mineral potential.  Seems to be linked to how old the rock is.  The more recent Tertiary and Quaternary period deposits are listed in these maps as having less potential then the others.  I also see that the mineral potential is somewhat correlated to the amount of claims in these areas. 

I think my next trip, probably this weekend, is to an unclaimed area that is listed as a gold mine.  The rock is more recent from the tertiary area, but if the mine did produce gold, perhaps there's some left in the washes.

I've also got a remote prospect IVO of black canyon city I'd like to check out.  No listings of what come from it, but the area has gold and less valuable minerals mined there.

What surprised me about the Black Canyon area is about twice as much gold came out of there historically than the Wickenburg area.

I would really love to go backpacking in to these areas.  I'm getting sick of the 4 wheel Razors bothering me.

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So the key to Bradshaw gold is the Yavapai schist belt. If you look at the linked map you can see a horseshoe shaped deposit that spreads across the Bradshaws. Now if you cross check that with a topo map or AZGS AZ mines .kml you will see that most of the gold mines are in or on the edge of the belt. The veins are of pre-cambrian age. The linked USGS Bulletin 782 is a good starting point. If your in the shist belt and see quartz stringers especially with malachite or azurite associated I'd slow down and focus on that stuff.

https://pubs.usgs.gov/bul/0782/report.pdf

https://pubs.usgs.gov/bul/0782/plate-2.pdf

 

Edited by Desertpilot
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On ‎10‎/‎31‎/‎2017 at 8:10 PM, Desertpilot said:

Hey Chrisski,

I know how you feel until I got spooled up on geology I used to travel hours from my house to detect/drywash. What I've really learned lately is spend the time at spots close to home. By hitting the spots close to home I've been able to spend more time in the field than driving and also learn the geology better.

DP

Small scale's no different than commercial machine ops, it's not how much you make, it's how much you spend. If you drive $100.00 worth of gas away from home to find $100.00 worth of gold, you'll be insolvent in short order...

Keep expenses low, then you don't need to be so worried about finding the big stuff to recover expenses. When the small stuff covers your fuel, it's a lot more fun.

PS: Don't become too successful ok, I'm in your same area and plan on hitting the same areas so save a couple pickers for me. :Just_Cuz_06:

Edited by Guest

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14 hours ago, Desertpilot said:

So the key to Bradshaw gold is the Yavapai schist belt. If you look at the linked map you can see a horseshoe shaped deposit that spreads across the Bradshaws. Now if you cross check that with a topo map or AZGS AZ mines .kml you will see that most of the gold mines are in or on the edge of the belt. The veins are of pre-cambrian age. The linked USGS Bulletin 782 is a good starting point. If your in the shist belt and see quartz stringers especially with malachite or azurite associated I'd slow down and focus on that stuff.

https://pubs.usgs.gov/bul/0782/report.pdf

https://pubs.usgs.gov/bul/0782/plate-2.pdf

 

Thanks for sharing DP, this is awesome.....

Jen

Edited by Guest

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31 minutes ago, jjbond said:

Thanks for sharing DP, this is awesome.....

Jen

My thought exactly..!

Bit of a bummer it's just under $500 each way for guzzeline from here, speaking of above..:th:

Swamp

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Desert Pilot--That 1926 map s amazing. Used to be a bit more habitation out there.  Can barely find a trace of it on Google Map imagery.

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Agree,

Those old USGS bulletins are pretty sweet. 

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Most states have a bureau of mines, dept of geology, etc that sell all kinds of information to the public on a given area. All you have to do is contact them and tell them what you've looking  for and they'll send a list to choose from. You'd be surprised what's available if you ask. 

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Chrisski,

Click on the link and scroll down to the bottom map. Each pin is a placer deposit that is on file with AZGS. Clicking on the pin will provide a link to the file. Note the western edge of the schist belt is loaded with placer deposits. 

http://minedata.azgs.az.gov/map-search?title=&field_keywords_spatial_value=Placer&field_keywords_thematic_value=&distance[latitude]=34.066007896979784&distance[longitude]=-112.33782958984375&distance[search_distance]=30&distance[search_units]=mile

Edited by Desertpilot

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Thanks.  With the 1926 map, I have been trying to get that matched up with googlemap.  It's actually been a fun project.  Seems like some of these older maps may have been a bit off.  Could be a combination of no aerial photography, unknown datum, and maybe just guesswork on part of the surveyors.  I could be wrong with matching the map points to google imagery.  The recent USGS maps are spot on with google maps, but some of the roads off this 1926 image seem to have drifted by a couple of hundred meters.  When I compare the 1926 map to the google images, some of the buildings show no signs of being there and looks like a terrible place to build a bulding like in a wash.

Every time I get an area plotted to go to it's a bit too remote for the time I have over the next few weeks, but with a quad or bike I could get there.  Those are the areas I would really like to get to.

Going to come a point when I need to put my finger on a spot and just go.

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If there is one suggestion I could make, it's that you don't necessarily need to go out to the boonies to find gold.  Especially when you're still learning to find gold.

Club claims are great places to learn how to find gold.  Believe it or not, there are still some good finds to be made in really obvious places.  I personally have made finds in gullies that run parallel to a well traveled road in a well known and popular area.  I'm talking like 50 feet or less from the road.  The finds were made in a gully that AT LEAST a hundred or more detectorists went through before I got there.  I simply rolled a cantaloupe sized rock with my foot and there was a target signal underneath.  It was gold.  Rocks that have lichens on top and are a different color on the bottom haven't moved in a very long time.  Just trying to pass along a few tips.  Good Luck out there.

Luke

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55 minutes ago, LukeJ said:

I simply rolled a cantaloupe sized rock with my foot and there was a target signal underneath.  It was gold

Excellent advise. 

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I went to a 60 year old gold mine a few miles from the Little San Domingo, didn't find gold, but was more remote.  Plenty of trash in the wash.  This was about an hour hike.  I did see brass colored casings, so the hunters do go up there.

A few miles from that popular area really cuts down on traffic.  The jeep trail indicated on the mid 80's map was no longer there.  It had been washed away with 3' boulders, trees growing in the wash, and where the jeep trail left the wash was overgrown with vegetation no different than the surrounding area.  and impassable to jeep, quad, or motorbike. 

I found no gold detecting the wash or the tailings piles, but the tailings pile had a bunch of copper ore.  Makes me think the mine was a small, small copper operation, and somehow gold and silver ended up on the database.  I posted a pick of the ore and what must have been one of the small trucks used to transport the ore.

Still trying to find an area by the Yavapai Schist I can access.  My truck is a F250 and not the best trail vehicle.  I am getting closer to buying a quad to get around.  My stopping points with the truck make it too much of a hike for me to BLM land, but I'll find something.

CAM00700.jpg

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That old truck cab looks very familiar. Been quite a few years since I been there though. 

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I was wondering if any other forum members had been there.  The truck is definitely just a cab.  No engine, gauges, or seats.  That whole area is an odd place for cab off engine work.  Here's another pictures of some parts, not sure if they're part of the truck, but found these at the mine.  The left looks like a seat, and the right a muffler.  I also found on a hill what may have been the pick up bed.  Whenever that mine was operational it kept a small crew busy for a few months.  The deepest tunnel looks like I may go further, but is blocked by debris.

CAM00704.jpg

CAM00705.jpg

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Boy I would have Dug out some of this for Smash and Panning .

 

 

Interesting.jpg

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I did not notice that.  I wonder if it is just an anomaly in the photo.  I put a couple of more in and it shows the upper digging.  A the single picture has the same area circled in yellow.  I do look for the ugly black quartz that around here can indicate gold ore, but I did not see any that day.  Might be worth another trip back to the area. 

I was concentrating not falling in the hole separating me from the picture and the bees nest to the right of that out of the picture.  That definitely looks different than the black desert varnish that covers most of the rock.  That particular vein in the yellow is at eye level, but it across a six foot square whole that is ten to 20 feet deep.

I never even thought about crushing a sample the entire day.  The geological maps put the area as aa Tertiary Lava, 12-24 million years old. In general that area has a base red rock I think is a rhyolitc tuff made from lava ash.  There's also some dacite in places where the creek cuts underneath this rhyloitic tuff.  The mine itself barely makes minedat and is listed as a copper gold primary with a secondary silver.  Perhaps the dark black could be silver.  At $17 per ounce, I'd need pounds of that black ore to make it worth my while.

Not much out there on hard rock mining.

Part of the planning I do before I go to a place is look at the USGS maps, look at Google Maps, and look at a geological map, after I've determined an area is open.  I keep my notes electronically, in case I ever want to go back.  Also, they are just notes.  After I made the second picture, I checked the maps and where I said it was 50' down to the wash, the map actually had a 300' elevation change.  I usually spend close to 40 hours of research deciding on a place.

Digging 3 #2.jpg

Digging 3.jpg

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