Dropping a co-claimant from claim

[Steel Pan]

One of my co-claimants wishes to be dropped from the claim.

He's moving to Hawaii and doesn't expect to be coming back to the mainland.

This has to happen quickly since it's time for my yearly filing.

Any ideas on how I should proceed?

[devilishjim]

Well a notarized statement from him selling his share to you for $1 should do it

edit: Or just leave the paperwork as is and continue paying his share, But I would hesitate to let him know when you strike it rich

Edited August 3, 2013 by devilishjim

[Golden Ray]

Have your friend sign a 'Ouit Claim' form over to you. or another member of

your group. This means he has turned over 'any & all rights' he has in that claim.

We just leave name on BLM paperwork as is, if you sell claim to another party,

give them that quit claim along with yours.

If BLM send everyone in your group a 'Address veritication' form, you can file

a 'Amenment' form ($10.00 cost) with BLM. No problems.

[Bedrock Bob]

He must file a quit claim to the mineral rights but you must also backfill that empty spot in your assn. claim with another claimant. Once someone files a quitclaim he is no longer a valid claimant and your claim has a hole in it.

Since every 20 acres had to be paid for now it makes a strange deal with an assn. claim. It is best to simply have individual claims. Think about it... there really is no advantage to partners in multiple claims anymore. But the requirement for one claimant for each 20 acres has not changed.

If one claimant files a quit claim you suddenly are not valid. Most guys are dropping the assn. placcer claims and simply filing as a single claimant. Your "partners" are really of no consequence to the BLM and are in fact a liability. They could only cast doubt on the validity of the claim unless you backfill the spot.

[Bedrock Bob]

A mining company holds multiple individual claims in the name of the company. The shareholders are controlled by the company and NOT BY BLM.

Association placer claims are the same cost per claim but shareholders are subject to BLM rules. If you make a mistake validity is questionable.

Why not form a partnership and file the claims under the name of the business rather than the names of the partners? It seems the most logical way to handle it now that you most pay for every claim anyway.

Edited August 3, 2013 by Bedrock Bob

[Uncle Ron]

If you have been filing your small miners' waiver and performing the assessment work each year along with filing POL, the partner dropping out can quitclaim to one of the other members ... If you've been paying the fees rather than actually working the claim, then you're screwed and might as well break the assn. claim into a bunch of separate ones ... Actually, if you had a valid association all members can quit claim to one member so long as the work is done rather than fees paid ... Once you start paying fees, you are back to separate 20 acre claims ... At least, this is the way it is in Arizona ... Don't know about New Mexico, but am pretty sure that in Kalifornia each member of the association has to bury a bit of their foreskin on each claim corner ... Cheers,Unc

Edited August 3, 2013 by Uncle Ron

[sawmill]

A valid mining claim can be bought,sold, traded,or transferred,just like any real estate.

An association claim is counted as one claim, for legal purpose. After a discovery is made

and the location is perfected,individuals can transfer,their interest with a quit claim deed.

It does not leave a hole in the claim. If you are paying fees,you just have to cough up his

share of the fees. If you are claiming a small miner waiver,you just have to keep up his share

of the assessment work. Just file a copy of the quit claim with the county,and BLM,with your

waiver . Or you can just leave his name on the paper work,and go on about your business.

If you go with the quit claim,make sure it is made out to you or the association,as a group.

Transferring interest in a perfected association claim does not void any part of the claim,

or cause need to break up the claim,for the remaining claimants. Your friend could sell his

interest at this point to anyone,and not affect the validity of the claim. All the new owner

would gain is a percentage of one association claim ,not a specified area of an association

claim,but a share of the whole acreage.

Since it is this close to filing dead line,I would just leave it as is,until next filing period. This

gives you time to get your ducks in a row.

[Micro Nugget]

Note that quitclaim deed requirements can vary from state to state. In California it has to be notarized BOTH for the grantor AND the grantee. There are numerous web sites that will sell a format for a quitclaim deed that will include the local requirements for the state of the claim situs. Typically they cost around $20 to fill out online. You must be certain to describe exactly the property you are transferring be it by BLM Claim Number and cadastral survey or metes and bounds description as contained in the Notice of Location. Thus, before your friend sails off for Hawaii he could execute a quitclaim deed before a notary and leave it with the new grantee of his choice (later to be recorded and a copy submitted to BLM).

[El Dorado]

Consider the last three post, the way it is. JUst do the QuickClaim transfer

[Steel Pan]

I understand that I must file a new map and info describing

the change to both the county and BLM.

The claim can stay in tact, just minus a 20 acre parcel off one end.

As far as breaking it up into separate 20 acre claims,...

That would make all partners pay the $10.00 maint. fee

waiver instead of breaking the $10.00 up between us.

AND, each pay out the filing fees for new claims. No thank you.

We may just find another partner.

[sawmill]

Steel Pan

You kinda missed the point! You do not have to take any acres off the claim,if your

partner,deeds his interest over to you or the rest of your group. It can still continue as

it was started. You do not need to alter or change the description or paper work.

[Steel Pan]

Steel Pan

You kinda missed the point! You do not have to take any acres off the claim,if your

partner,deeds his interest over to you or the rest of your group. It can still continue as

it was started. You do not need to alter or change the description or paper work.

Actually, I did get it.

I should have explained that "I was told" it would go smoother if claim reduced or

new co-claimant. The BLM does not, and sometimes doesn't, have to accept the

change. Some thing about them not liking one person having more than the 20 ac.

Seems that ya start getting into having to "prove" recoverable minerals.

Worst case it that they can nullify the claim and have ya start over.

I need to go back and re-read laws again.

Memory just ain't that good no more.

[Hoser John]

No reductions in size or absolutely nuttn' mandated. Once a claim is perfected a association can be sold to a single individual with the filing of a simple quitclaim. Stupid kalif and our mandated notary work is absurd but welcome to the state a stupidity..John.

[Steel Pan]

Here's the response I got from BLM in D. C.

"If there is a claimant that is no longer interested in being part of the claim, he/she can send in a letter of relinquishment - there is no form. They just need to list the serial number and claim name and state that they wish to relinquish their interest in the claim. They do not need to list an actual legal description of the claim, because all claimants of an association placer have equal interest in the full claim. Then, you will fill out an amended location notice (just a location notice marked AMENDED), making sure to list the serial number on the amendment, and fill in the legal description and acreage to show that you are amending the claim to reduce the acreage. Have the amendment recorded in the county (before sending to the BLM) and then when you get it back from the county, you'll send it to the BLM with a $10 processing fee. You could send the relinquishment and the amendment at the same time if you wanted...that way the adjudicator would know you were reducing the acreage because someone dropped out of the association."

[Bedrock Bob]

Here's the response I got from BLM in D. C.

"If there is a claimant that is no longer interested in being part of the claim, he/she can send in a letter of relinquishment - there is no form. They just need to list the serial number and claim name and state that they wish to relinquish their interest in the claim. They do not need to list an actual legal description of the claim, because all claimants of an association placer have equal interest in the full claim. Then, you will fill out an amended location notice (just a location notice marked AMENDED), making sure to list the serial number on the amendment, and fill in the legal description and acreage to show that you are amending the claim to reduce the acreage. Have the amendment recorded in the county (before sending to the BLM) and then when you get it back from the county, you'll send it to the BLM with a $10 processing fee. You could send the relinquishment and the amendment at the same time if you wanted...that way the adjudicator would know you were reducing the acreage because someone dropped out of the association."

BINGO!!!

[Steel Pan]

That scenario is only if you relinquish a portion of the claim.

Or, the share could be turned over to the remaining co-claimants.

(I'm awaiting verification on that)

OR,... deed that portion/share to another person and maintain head count.

(helps keep individual costs down)

Hmmmm,.... just happen to know an ol' boy that would fit right in.

[Steel Pan]

O. K., here's the latest response from BLM.

" The members of the group that located the association placer all have an equal share in the claim. Each has a proportionate interest in the whole claim...not an individual parcel or acreage. So, if your claim is 80 acres, and there are four claimants associated with that 80 acres (allowed 20 acres per claimant), then you each have a 25% interest in the full 80 acres. If someone relinquishes their portion of the claim, then their interest would be divided equally among the remaining claimants. If the claimant wanted to deed his interest to a specific person, he could do that, but he would be deeding 100% of his interest to the individual. The BLM does not specifically keep track of "interest" in mining claims but the deed could still be recorded for the record. We would want to make certain that the person deeding his interest still had his interest to give or sell before we recorded the deed.

In an association placer claim, each claimant is allowed to bring 20 acres to the association placer because that is what the law says he's entitled to. Once the claim is located as an association placer, however, all acreage becomes a joint interest with no one owning a specific 20-acre portion. If someone transfers or relinquishes their interest, you will probably still be required to reduce the acreage of the claim to meet the 20-acre per claimant limit. You just want to be sure that if you reduce the acreage, that the remaining acreage is still contiguous."

And that, Folks, is about all I have to say on this subject.

[nvchris]

Just proves you don't have to know the code to work at the BLM.

[clay]

I couldn't have said it better Chris!

Just proves you don't have to know the code to work at the BLM.

[Steel Pan]

Just proves you don't have to know the code to work at the BLM.

Chris, is there a prob with the info from BLM?

[nvchris]

Get the BLM book,

Location and Valadity Mining Claims.

Read the reg's for yourself.

But know this, Sawmill is correct 99.99 % of the time.

[Bedrock Bob]

Get the BLM book,

Location and Valadity Mining Claims.

Read the reg's for yourself.

But know this, Sawmill is correct 99.99 % of the time.

And he will spend 99.99% of the time arguing that .001% too.

Everyone tries to interpret the law. Then the BLM has their policy. And there is conflict. And discussion.

In the end there is how it gets done. You can go down waiving a paper and telling them how it is supposed to be done or you can do what they say needs to be done. What ever way you think works in your best interests.

I had the same deal and met with the same conundrum in the info. It was not about a legal crusade for me. I just wanted to hold the group of claims as easy and cheaply as I could. So I filled the spot with another partner, amended the claim and things were groovy.

The law probably says something all together different and every BLM policy and procedure may be clueless. But at some point you have to wade through all that muck.

Edited August 10, 2013 by Bedrock Bob

[sawmill]

Bob

I have 3 association mining claims. The advice I gave came from the head Arizona BLM

ajudication officer,a mining law proffessor,and a high dollar mining attorney . No you don't

just roll over because some desk jocky in a government office ,interpets the law to fit their

agenda.

[Bedrock Bob]

Sawmill, I know you know your stuff and relish the fight. It seems weak to not demand your full due and fight until you get it.

From my point of view I could care less about what the law says. I spend my time with a detector or a rifle in my hand. The policy is just the easiest way to get it done and I just don't have enough hours in a day to give a rats patoot about any of it.

If the object is to continue holding the mineral rights then do it the way they say to do it. You can always gripe about it and object all you want. If you want to challenge the info then you certainly can. But that is another fight all together that will put very little gold in the vial.

[El Dorado]

Get the book from the BLM learn the regs and fight for what is yours. There just is no excuse for Losing 20 acres from a good claim because of bad advice from a know it all on this forum or a BLM clerk giving bad advice. Learn the law yourself , it's easy and cheap.