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Nugget Shooter

Becoming more "Valuable" to the environment

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You know so often we hear that folks with metal detectors are just destroying the environment and trashing the places we visit. It is giving all of us a bad name and sadly some folks do indeed leave holes, messy camps, and litter along back country roads.

We have all seen it..... :*&$*(:

Folks I propose this.....

If each and every one of us at just this forum would just kick a few holes full now and then while out beeping instead of bitching about them later (you can still bitch)

And pick up trash in our parking areas and campsites

And blast across country blazing trails with their ATV when land use rules clearly prohibit same.

And truly say something to other hobbyists when you see them doing any of the above things and explain that they are giving enemies of this hobby/living more ammo with which to shut area after area down.

LOOK AROUND it is happening everywhere with road closure, mining restrictions, etc.

It would take some pressure off of us and put us in a different light! Heck as responsible detectorists we already haul off crap we dig up and remove pounds of lead from the environment while barely leaving a mark if we fill our holes right?

Why this post now? Recently had an argument with 2 guys out at LSD that were leaving dig holes all over the place and couldn't understand why it mattered to anyone. Well likely in the long haul a few small holes do not matter in many landscapes (to Nature) and will quickly disappear, but we are not the only ones out there trying to enjoy ourselves and nature loving folks get real pissed off when they see some of the messes modern prospectors are leaving in gold bearing areas and they have allot of power and money and will keep fighting until they get their way and new laws are passed to stop it.

I was also told by a club member working a claim at LSD who visited my shop that a very nice BLM Ranger had visited his site the day before taking photos of holes and had been doing the same section by section for 2 weeks and also said some of the local clubs would be hearing from them yet again. He got quite an earful in that short conversation and was glad he was indeed following the rules by back filling his digs.

Heck perhaps we should start a thread showing photos of trash we haul out and camps we have cleaned so folks will realize how much good the single prospector and local clubs do in keeping mining areas clean after others have made the mess. Perhaps then the focus will turn to the real folks leaving these messes in gold bearing areas. Heck ATV users have absolutely crisscrossed the Little San Domingo with trails and scarred the landscape for miles just to see the dust fly as they roar around. Yes I own an ATV and have nothing against the tool just some of the idiots using them. You should see the trashy camp areas and litter they leave behind in nthe desert and you can't go far out there without seeing a plastic grocery bag flapping in a tree when there is a breeze.

Well rant over, but if you do leave holes, trash, or blaze through areas with no roads with your ATV....... YOU are the very ones that will cause legislation to destroy our hobby! :bang:

Think about it.... :twocents:

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Right on about every subject Bill....some days here I fill many more holes than I dig...I don't have the FS or politic ans

here that are controlling everything there but I do it out of respect for the farm or ranch....there's been at least a

couple of time after filling one of my holes I would turn around and see the rancher or Foreman on horseback watching

and he would give me the thumbs up sign.....a good gesture....telling a land owner that your trying to get permission

from that you refill your holes and any others you find can also help....

A good post Bill....

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Hey Bill; I get almost as tired from filling someone else's digs as I do digging and filling my own. Also, I am constantly amazed at the bottles and cans I see left in areas I go...almost certainly thrown down by some detectorist or drywasher dolt...they seem to feel the same inalienable right to litter that cigarette smokers have always had...yes, I know I am pissing someone off...too bad...my mother taught me to clean up after myself...apparently not taught, or learned by many of the brethern.

fred

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Right on.

First me must remember we are a very some percentage of the population. The general population could care less if we coudn't do what we do---giving them reason makes it harder on us. Some urbanite that goes "hiking" twice a year has more sway with politician class then we have.

The biggest beef I had with the groups/clubs was that they would not be pro-active in getting that message across. Just because it is a membership claim many think gives them leadway in bending the rules.

I believe in self enforcement---don't be afraid to say something to someone doing wrong---don't be "partners" with these types.

Don's point is a great one. The main reason land-owners wont let me on their properties is what others have done. Past actions will always cloud peoples mind. Most greenies think you're out there hydro-blasting a hill side.

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I have been in the gold detecting hobby only a short time and live in the Yuma Foot hills and have kept my detecting limited to the Laguna Placer area. I have seen all the holes, trash, spray paint cans, and bottles scattered all over the place. It really shows the disrespect that people have for the country out here in the south west. I have picked up piles of shot guns shell case's and bottles, pop cans and taken them home and put in my garbage can only to return up there later and see where more has been left behind by others. It seems like a losing battle between us who care about our inviroment and those who do not. We can only keep trying and hope that one day these people who do not care will eventually get the hint ! Zuki :*&$*(:

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You always leave it the way you found it. Or better.

The "trashers" are everywhere. You see that attitude on public land from a lot of people. Wannabe prospectors, wannabe hunters, wannabe fishermen, wannabe lumberjacks, wannabe outdoorsmen. What seperates the sheep from the goats is ethics and respect. Some folks just dont have either.

I haul truckloads of crap from the Santa Fe National Forest that the local woodcutters leave. They load up the truck with household garbage, go to the mountains, unload the garbage in the forest and cut a load of firewood. There are hundreds of these fools in my neck of the woods. And then the wannabe ATV racers that go down every forest service road as fast as the can handle the curves. Twice I have collided with an ATV on on a little two track forest trail because these idiots were traveling too fast to stop before they hit me.

People are out of hand. Aldo Leopold said somethign to this effect.... That "a hunter generally had no audience to applaud or disprove of his actions. The importance of this cannot be overstated." That applies to any outdoor activity where a man has no witnesses to what he does. It is too bad that so many in our society fail any test of self discipline as soon as nobody is looking.

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Well I fill all my holes, pick up trash but I am one of the ones who offroads my atv. I don't spin the wheels or go out of my way to tear up the dirt but I will do my part to help by staying on the trails or washes this year.

Great post Bill

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I also see a lot of cans and plastic bottles out there in the hydraulics. I always pick them up and they are worth money too. I cant stand to walk by an aluminum can sitting where everybody parks, its stupid IMO. Also when i go to shooting ranges i attempt to pick up all my shells even though many are steel case and always pick up whats around me, including shotgun shells which i dont even shoot but since they are usually red they stand out a lot and I could see people complain about them.

Something else i see in some hydraulics is county marker signs for whatever pulled up out of the ground for no reason at all then somebody being an ass. Thats the kind of crap that closes places down. I just ran into this the other day and put it back where it belonged. What are they thinking that the county people wont get mad at the fences cut down and sign post pulled?

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Bill,

Good topic. I always try to leave the desert in better shape than when I came to it. Filling in holes, and picking up trash. The sad thing is with the projected U.S. population to reach close to 360 million people by 2020, you are going to see more and more of this, unfortunately. Like the old saying goes, all it takes is 1 to ruin it. I always tell friends and family I give it less than 20 years before the deserts are completely closed, you will only be allowed on by a guide.

Dave

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Guest Gripper

Lots of good posts here, thanks for starting this Bill. I fill my holes and the ones of others, all the time. Everything around me is claimed by ghost miners, and I am down to the the ground around here not available to claim. As I work this public ground fortunately not open to claim, I am continually asked by fellow Americans as to what I am doing. Citizens judge, and look over the ground that I have worked as to how they will evaluate detectorists on our public lands. Keeping it clean and as undisturbed as possible is the only way to keep this spot open. Keep it clean gents.

Brian

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Well I fill all my holes, pick up trash but I am one of the ones who offroads my atv. I don't spin the wheels or go out of my way to tear up the dirt but I will do my part to help by staying on the trails or washes this year.

Great post Bill

In AZ there is also a rather large fine and other penalties associated with off trail riding...... I think washes are OK though.

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All: By all means take photo's to show the agencies what you came accross and what you did to clean it up.. When I was in the Backcountry Housemans group we cleaned up a lot of trash out of the forest, documenting this, and the hours spent was the only way of saving a lot of the trails that the inviros wanted us out of. If you don't have proof of your commitment to keep the area's cleaned up they will blame the mess on all of us..

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This is something I am adament about, does it piss me off to pick up others trash, yes without a doubt but I fill in holes carry a garbage bag and remove trash... What is important if folks stop by from Federal Agencies they will see that you have done something and on our claims in Ak that I think is an unspoken blessing............Geo

I don't mind pissing folks off if you smoke, take your crap with you........

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All, just a quick note on off highway vehicle (anything with a motor to move it and no pavement under it) use...

Based on the BLM and Forest zservice's combined inventory that started 5-6 years ago, the rule is "if it is not an established and/or inventoried route you're not supposed to be on it."

What does this mean?

You have to know if it is a route that has been in use for ranching, mining or other acceptable use, you can go to the appropriate office and either get pictures of or buy the inventory map, or you can look for the open to motorized travel signage (which was never put in place). Most smaller washes are not considered open, even those out at LSD and the Rich Hill area.

When I had my Jeep we would place checkerboard flags on our CB antennae and monitor channel 7. The forest and BLM folks knew by the flag we were there to help if called upon and would check in with us on Ch 7 from time to time. I've been out of the club for a while, so I don't even know if that program still exists.

Personally... Here's a story that happened not too long ago.

My old boss, who is still a friend, posted some pics of he and his family out shooting up a failed water heater on Facebook.

I immediately laid into him via comments and text messages that he better have drug that thing out and disposed of it properly or I was going to make his life hell.

The pics came down, he apologized via a phone call and sent me a picture later that day of his son's pickup in his driveway with a bullet-riddled water heater in the bed.

They went back out and got it.

I still laid into him for leaving it in the first place.

Hell, I even stink myself up by throwing my cig butts in my pocket and they are biodegradable!

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I have spent the last 45 years Hunting and Fishing aroud Wa. Part of my Hunting gear i carry is a Plastic bag or 2 for the Heart or liver, but it is used more for trash. In my fishing vest it carry a couple of Plastic bags for eggs,but is used for trash on the stream banks. I pickup old shot shells and brass whenevere I see it and pack it out. Trash goes it the Garbage when we dump Brass goes it the barrel for recycle. I like GlenM also put butts in my pocket. Just a habit from Plumbing 1-3 million $ homes. They don't like to see them on the ground. I don't toss em at home either. Allways have a pocket full. And I hate people who spit thier GUM on the ground also. Thats worse than Cig butts!!!!!

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The flood of homeless have ravaged my claims for years. BLM tried for years to assist by bulldozing and hauling off tons and tons a year. METH LABS in old travel trailers have left behind a HUGE legacy of contamination. About 10 years ago I was teaching folks how to dredge on Whiskey Creek(cancer kids Make A wish Foundation GREAT FOLKS) and guys in spacesuits showed up and we had to adios with all 3 dredges as tests showed chemical dumping. They brought in barrels,more haz mat folks,dug all up,sealed in barrels and hauled to McColls dump at over a couple a thousand a barrel,did over 40-- 55 gallon barrels--always leave any where I go cleaner than when I showed up--cool-thanx for the new forum too -tons a au 2 u 2 -John

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The flood of homeless have ravaged my claims for years. BLM tried for years to assist by bulldozing and hauling off tons and tons a year. METH LABS in old travel trailers have left behind a HUGE legacy of contamination. About 10 years ago I was teaching folks how to dredge on Whiskey Creek(cancer kids Make A wish Foundation GREAT FOLKS) and guys in spacesuits showed up and we had to adios with all 3 dredges as tests showed chemical dumping. They brought in barrels,more haz mat folks,dug all up,sealed in barrels and hauled to McColls dump at over a couple a thousand a barrel,did over 40-- 55 gallon barrels--always leave any where I go cleaner than when I showed up--cool-thanx for the new forum too -tons a au 2 u 2 -John

Meth heads plague the land here as well sadly....

You are welcome on the new forum John and I am more than willing to do my part in getting more folks active to help stop these land grabs and restrictions before they become the (cough cough) law instead of complaining after the fact. Rick from WMA sent me an email about posting info from their outfit and as long as they are the real deal I will offer this forum as a stump.

NuggetShooter is down for the fight!

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