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Garrett Infinium vs Whites TDI


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I have a Minelab GPX5000 for my main detector. I bought the Infinium for the wife. I really like the Infinium so when my wife stated she wanted something that did not need headphones with I purchased a whites TDI. I have a whites GMT also but I prefer the PI's for serious nuggett hunting.

Anyways after going out with both I have been somewhat dissappointed with the TDI so far. I know I am still learning the TDI somewhat but the depth compared to the Infinium is dissappointing after all I have been reading about on the whites.

I am running the 8" mono on my Infinium so that may be helping. I want to try a NF or coiltech on the TDI to see if that helps. Im not going to come to any conclustions yet until I do more shooting with both and learn the TDI better, so far its just a first impression after running them over multiple targets.

I hit a target with the Infinium first then run the TDI over the same target to see how it responds and if it is anything deeper than 3-4" the TDI will not sound off. I will keep updating as I go along, as it very well could be my settings, but I feel im very close to the proper settings so we will see.

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Hello Whylee. I've been using a TDI for a bit over a year so far, and have no problem hearing much deeper signals than that.

Perhaps its the size of the object? I understand the TDI isn't real good with very small targets, although I have dug buckshot, and similar sized pieces of trash. I have dug larger trash targets down to 12". I think it was a 30 cal. slug.

I have only used a GMT before the TDI, and have no experience with other machines to compare though. I'm just ralaying what I've seen with mine.

Keep the faith, it's a great machine.

Patrick.....

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Whylee... You have a considerable amount of money invested in just

the three Pulses. First... the 5000 (which I could not swing

as I'm now 81, pretty deaf and artheritic) would be my first choice

if I was younger and able to get out and do some serious nugget

hunting.

Now about the Garrett Infinium, I was given one of the first off the

the line to evaluate (Lunk, Keith Semanko are you there to add to this?,

if so please do... tailgate here.) However, with either "mono's" I did

pretty well with it... Especially in the alkali in northern Nevada as

it is built stronger than a Sherman Tank... (I even used the smallest

5x7 DD between the cracks and under the brush... IF Montana Bob Dansie,

happems to read this thead, I now publically than him for not laughing

about my using such a "weenie" coil. Thank You Montana!... And, if I

could still physically do it, I would buy a 5000 from Montana and

go out in the field with him and learn how how to use it.)

Then as far as the TDI, I have one of the first "hole" detectors. With

the standard 12-inch coil, within less than an hour on my first trip

I found a nice nugget in the caliche in southern California using

Digger Bobs recommedations (Digger Bob are you out there?). However,

have found some nice nuggets with it as in some areas it does not need

to be ground balanced!... I

The important thing... is not the choice of machine... but to learn

it and use it... Actually I did pretty well with my 2200d which I

sold to Grubstake Gary Baldridge (are you out there Gary?)for the

cash money to buy the Infinium with which I did pretty well with it nugget

hunting; but even better detecting some southern California

beaches... especially San Clemente, and I still have two Garrett

Indiniums. Then I paid cash, even Calif state tax for mt TDI...

which has worked well for me in the Randsburg greater area...

So whatever detector... get out and use it... it will find gold if

you are where gold is to be found... so this leads to research as

now being the "key" as just over the last couple of years, there

has litterly been "hordes" of detectorists out swinging in the known

goldfields... but still overlooking fringe areas...

And last but not least... Whylee, I betcha a cup of coffee, that your

wife will out detect you... My Best... Ol' Jim Straight. :olddude:

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:twocents: For my $$$ I'd definately go with the Garret Inf as the only detector they make I'd use anymore, no problems with rain and moisture and a GREAT surf and underwater detector too as I dumped a few detectors in creeks nuggetshooting when slippage occurs and waves at the beach will kill that TDI FAST :hmmmmm: I used the stubbie shaft and always use smaller coils when nuggetshooting underwater as MUCH easier in creeks and rivers(ocean too) I like the righteous construction of the Garret Inf too as tough as need to be--just my take--tons a au 2 u 2 -John

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How are you setting the TDI??

I make the basic settings to start GEB fine at center and course at center then adjust as outlined, Target conductivity in the All position.

Pulse delay on 10 uS, gain 6-8 volume 3/4 - full position. Threshold to a nice hum. Where I am practicing with it the ground is very nice and balanceing is no problem. These were just starting settings, I have tried many others with not much luck on going deeper, My GMT has no problem picking up the deeper targets in the 6-8 inch range either, just cant get the TDI to that depth yet. By the way I have been using a few 45 caliber lead bullets and some silver coins to bury for practice.

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Howdy Hoser... Glad to see you are up and about...

Howdy Whylee.... do the .45 slugs

have a copper jacket? He may need some details as to the coil you are

using and which particular "model" TDI...

Now back to Reg... Whylee: I highly recommend you listen to him as

he is "MR. TDI," is most knowledgable(!) and will get you in the

groove.

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You are using the TDI Pro which is slightly different than the standard TDI. One difference is the ground balance which has two controls for the PRO. Now, I haven't played with the PRO but the adjustments should be very close to the regular TDI. This means, the coarse GB should be close to 8 or 9 when adjusted properly. BTW, that is what the manual says also. The fine adjust probably has the same adjustment as moving the coarse one number setting. What I don't know is whether when the fine adjustment is at max, if the GB coarse adjustment will be at 8 or 10 at proper GB adjustment.

So, why does this GB become important? Well, on the targets you are using, it is quite possible you will get less depth on the lead and the coins than if you had the proper setting.

The GB control adjusts an internal amplifier that is the GB signal used to cancel the GB signal in the main target channel of information. One other thing that happens is various target signals are also affected and can display less depth of detection.

Try a few air tests to see what I mean. Take one of the lead bullets and see how far from the coil you can detect the bullet with the setting you have. Then adjust the main GB to 9 or even max and check again. Repeat the air test with the main GB at min. You should see a range that will dip some probably somewhere near your setting.

If you repeat the same test but use a coin, you should see the coin gain in depth as you adjust the main GB from min to max.

If you use a small nugget like maybe a gram or two, you should see very little change as the GB is moved.

If you use a nail as the test target, you should see the nail change tones and right at the tone change, notice the nail depth of detection is quite a bit less.

Going back to the lead bullet, if this is a larger one, like maybe an old 3 ringer or even a 357 lead, you will notice the tone change will occur on that object also. At minimum delay you will get a high tone but at maximum you should get a low tone. Again, somewhere in between you will notice the depth of detection drops off.

Knowing the tone can change on certain targets as the GB is adjusted and also knowing that right at setting of the tone change, you will have a dip in depth of detection helps to better understand the detector. Before you panic, this happens on other PI's also (with some displaying this condition more than others), but has never been noted thoroughly.

Fully understanding this tone change issue is very important and will provide the owner with a lot of options not found on other detectors. As an example, after you become familiar with this tone feature and know fully how to use the single tone feature, you can hunt small gold, maybe less than 1/4 oz and ignore most nails. Yes, that is ignore, meaning they will not give a signal at all.

Another important feature to know is the gold characteristics from where you are hunting. Yes, that can make a huge difference. As a perfect example, I have a half oz nugget found at Rich Hill that gives a nice strong low tone with the GB at 9. Set the GB control at 6 and the depth of detection of that nugget drops significantly. Set the GB at max and the depth of detection increases dramatically.

Now, I have another half oz nugget found about 10 miles from Rich Hill and that nugget gives a strong high tone at all GB settings. In this case, if I were to select high conductor mode, I would miss all nuggets at least 1/2 oz or less. If I selected low conductor I could detect all half oz or smaller nugget and maybe most nuggets less than 1 to 2 oz while ignoring nails.

Now, with all the above said, my recommendation is to use the ALL mode to begin with, but play with the GB at least while testing targets in an air test to see what happens. Don't be surprised if the depth of detection doesn't double or become even more on certain targets as you vary the GB setting.

If you detector is working fine, you should see the TDI will have greater depth than your Infinium, especially on small gold. You should also notice that silver, copper, and clad coins larger than a dime give a low tone. Also, at a normal GB of 8 or 9 you should get a low tone from most nails that are of any size and not dramatically eroded. this same nail will probably give a high tone with a GB setting of 4 or so.

One more thing about this tone change. Deep targets are extremely difficult to tell a low tone from a high tone. Basically they sound the same or could sound the same on very weak signals. Selecting high tone and then low tone to check that target will let you know which tone it really is. Once the tone is known, you know more about the target or you will once you better understand the detector.

Let me know if this makes sense.

Reg

PS: A new owner should always start out with a delay setting of 10 usec if they are using the TDI for gold hunting.

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Great info there, Thank You. Im sure my final ground balance was somewhere in the 7-8 range after balancing, I just started them from the 6 (noon) position. The coil im using is the one that came on it. I will get out and do more practicing with this unit. I really like it myself, just want to make sure its performing properly.

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I just went outand tried adjusting the GB by keeping them set in the 7-9 range. even though the GB was good in the 5-6 range I went ahead and had the course se on 9 and the fine set to 8 and the depth really improved. Thanks for the info.

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Wyelee... Reg is most knowedgeable regarding the TDI. IMO it could be

the biggest challenge to the Minelab Pulses, but certainly not

up to calibre of the Minelab 5000.

Since in your first post you mentioned in the lead paragraph that

you have a Minelab GPX5000 for your main detector and bought the

Infinium for your wife but she wanted something that did not need

headphones and you got her a TDI...

All of this is fine... The TDI should be a good choice for your

wife... The pole can be dismantled from the control box and the

control box can be used as a chest/hip mount. If as a chest mount

the TDI speaker is pretty loud and clear if the day is quiet and

you could monitor her targets if you wish.

Now the reason why we buy a detector is to use it. It will not

find anything while in a box or bag... If you are into nugget

hunting you are not looking for a 45 calibre slug or a silver

coin... you are looking for either a small low conductive gold

nugget or a larger one that may be be higher conductive...

Not knowing where you are detecting it is rather impossible for

anyone to give you specfic tips as to "how to hunt" your choice

of gold-field. However I will give you my :twocents: Likely

whoever sold you your 5000 is more than willing to give you the

necessary "heads up/instruction" to become knoweledgable in using

it... and even be willing to meet you out in a gold field and

give you personal instruction on using your 5000 which is currently

the "Rolls-Royce" of all the Gold Specific Pulse Detectors...

:olddude:

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I have a couple of questions about the TDI Pro. Was it a new one or used? Do you have any other coils besides the 12" that normally comes with it?

The reason I ask these questions is to try to determine if there might be something incorrect or not and if so, why that may be the problem.

Now, one thing you can do is to set up a simple bench test using a simple penny as the test target. With the GB on and the coarse control set at 9, the gain about mid position, and the frequency adjusted for the least amount of noise, check the distance from the coil the penny can be detected with a weak but obvious signal. A realistic distance should be somewhere between 9" and 12". In ground depth should be about the same.

If you are still only getting 3" to 4" as you mentioned before, then there is probably something not correct. IF the 3" to 4" is the norm, does the signal simply seem to shut off sharply rather than become a very weak signal that seems to linger for a distance?

This air test should be done away from any TV or computer and any other electronic device if possible. A good test would be done out in the field away from most external noises for the best results. Regardless, the TDI should do a better job of ignoring noise if the frequency control is adjusted properly than the Infinium. The TDI should do a better job ignoring magnetite rocks also.

Reg

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I have a couple of questions about the TDI Pro. Was it a new one or used? Do you have any other coils besides the 12" that normally comes with it?

The reason I ask these questions is to try to determine if there might be something incorrect or not and if so, why that may be the problem.

Now, one thing you can do is to set up a simple bench test using a simple penny as the test target. With the GB on and the coarse control set at 9, the gain about mid position, and the frequency adjusted for the least amount of noise, check the distance from the coil the penny can be detected with a weak but obvious signal. A realistic distance should be somewhere between 9" and 12". In ground depth should be about the same.

If you are still only getting 3" to 4" as you mentioned before, then there is probably something not correct. IF the 3" to 4" is the norm, does the signal simply seem to shut off sharply rather than become a very weak signal that seems to linger for a distance?

This air test should be done away from any TV or computer and any other electronic device if possible. A good test would be done out in the field away from most external noises for the best results. Regardless, the TDI should do a better job of ignoring noise if the frequency control is adjusted properly than the Infinium. The TDI should do a better job ignoring magnetite rocks also.

Reg

The TDI Pro was purchased new and I only have the standard coil that it came with. I bought it a couple of weeks ago but with all the weather we have been getting its been hard to get out. I am mainly nuggett shooting with it. I will be in the Nor Cal Sierras,and NV dessert with some cal dessert shooting in the future.

I have practiced with my Infinium and GPX5000 for the past few months. The GPX5000 is very easy to use if you use the preset settings, but I will start getting into the custom settings later after I become more versed with it.

I know there is alot to learn and I by no means think I am going to go out and find everything. Its people like everyone here that helps us all out.

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:thumbsupanim RIGHTEOUS THREAD- thanx for the info much as haven't been able to TDI yet as just tooo busy and still playing with the new GBPro--by the by --good at the beach too-wet or dry black sands whatever it still seems to purr right along. My timing was right as the entire section of beaches,river mouth was nailed by the tsunami and 4 days earlier and I was there and would/could have been a mite ugly--thanks again for the info. Soon as done I'll get on buying a TDI but couple a days in court helping buds out in a legal battle--tons a au 2 u 2-John PS-Thanx much Jim for the concern--knee gonna get a new one this year,but may wait till late summer as op now would kill the summer and I must DREDGE--- :inocent: detect and run the hills in the glorious summer heat-- :olddude:
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There are places where little to no ground balance is needed. In those places, you won't see much improvement in ground balance signal when you adjust the GB control from 6 to 9. Keep in mind that in places where there the detector works without any GB, the depth of detection of all targets will improve significantly. Using a DD coil will also help reduce the ground signal in all areas but may allow you to run without any GB in many areas also.

The next thing to remember is to practice with your TDI to better understand what happens as you adjust any control. Checking depth differences on desirable targets as you adjust the GB even in an air test will help learn what can happen. This will give you a better idea of the best technique to use when nugget hunting.

This depth variation as the GB is adjusted is extremely important to know and understand. One can easily double the depth of detection quite easily with a simple adjustment. Although the TDI can be an almost turn on and go detector, to get the most out of it requires knowing more about the controls and what happens when they are adjusted.

All too often people don't try to understand the controls and how they can affect the depth capabilities and then they find themselves being disappointed because of a particular situation or particular target comparison.

Once a person learns the TDI well, they can do things with this detector that can't be done with others. As an example, one can walk through a nail infested area and ignore nails while detecting many of the nuggets. Small gold requires one setting and large gold requires a different setup, but both sizes of gold can be hunting in those trashy areas while most nails. To get a better idea how this can be done simply take a nail and pass it under or over the coil. Then adjust the GB control through its range making a pass with the nail over the coil at each GB change. You will find a typical GB setting where the nail changes tones. Usually, this is around 5 to 6 on the GB setting but could vary some.

Now, once a person has a better idea of what to expect as the GB is adjusted, they can separate good targets from junk. Keep in mind that gold follows no rules and a nugget from one area may give a low tone but one from another area the same size may generate a high tone. Understanding this can happen and knowing more about the gold from a particular area will also help determine just how to set the detector for the best results. Otherwise, one should simply hunt an area in the ALL mode or twice using the single tone mode with one GB setting in HIGH conductor mode and a different GB setting in the LOW conductor mode to be safe.

Now with all that said, most gold less than 1/4 oz will respond as a low conductor. So, a person can hunt for this size in either the ALL or the LOW mode with little fear of missing it completely. Larger gold above 1/2 oz can respond as either a low conductor or as a high conductor depending upon the gold characteristics. Remember, if the gold transitions from a low conductor to a high conductor (tone change), the gold may or may not be detected in the single tone mode. The gold between 1/4 oz and 1/2 oz will usually be the trickiest to find at the greatest depth because much of it transitions somewhere in this zone especially if the gold is quite pure and very solid. One may have to hunt an area twice with different GB settings for the best results.

Gold that is less pure or very coarse may remain a low conductor (high tone) even on much larger size nuggets. This is why it helps to know more about the gold in the area you are hunting. If you are not familiar with the gold, the about the only thing one can assume is smaller gold, less than 1/4 oz will respond as a low conductor. Since most gold found today is small, then low conductor signals are the most likely to be the ones that might be gold. Usually, these are nice smooth mellow responses. Very wide sharp raspy responses are quite often small pieces of tin cans. So, with practice, one can separate out much of that trash also.

Once again, practice and experimenting help a great deal. So, I strongly recommend TDI owners do it sufficiently until they are confident. Simply following someone's settings is not recommended at all. All too often the settings are not the best or may not be the best for the area you are hunting.

Reg

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Whylee... this has become a great thread re: the Minelab 5000, Garrett Infinium

and the White's TDI. All have there strong points; all have their weak points.

Apples and oranges... even a Gala apple viz a Granny Smith... As for me, I have

been a freelance gold-specific field tester for "Western & Eastern Treasures" magazine

since 1983 and I have found that all of the major manufacturers put out pretty good

machines... but sadly, some of the users do not take the time to get the best out of

it. And a detetector setting in a closet only finds dust... Jim Straight

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a detetector setting in a closet only finds dust...

Jim that is a great quote and with your permission I would like to add it to my signature...

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Gosh Bill... I cannot claim I originated that "quote."

But it is sorta catchy... So feel free to use it...

Another one I like... "here is where the rubber hits

the asphalt."

And one thing for sure Bill... over the many years

I have watched your forum grow and grow; and become

the best it is... Very impressive Ol' Friend... Jim :olddude:

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