Jump to content
Nugget Shooter Forums

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

meteoritewatch

Meteorite Hunting Association

Recommended Posts

(continued from another thread: http://www.nuggetshooter.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=17282 )

I've been talking with and proposed an idea some very well known hunters a while back about the formation of a "Meteorite Hunting Association" and other informative and educational meteorite related programs and they think this is a great idea!

Meteorite hunters have supplied universities, museums and scientific institutions with meteorites for study for decades. The laws are not new, but the publicity the meteorite world is getting is. More and more people are learning about meteorites and are realizing the fun and adventure that one can have hunting meteorites. But, there is a "code" or creed that all professional meteorite hunters go by, one that should be organized into a cohesive association. You can take part by joining the Meteorite Hunting Association. It's time for organization that brings together professional hunters that want to take part in something bigger than themselves. There will be more information available on how to join soon.

Right now your suggestions and opinions are welcome and now is the time to express them as the association is created so they can be considered and/or added to the associations list of criteria and/or rules of the road.

First thing. What do you think the mission of such a group should be? Below are my thoughts on this... You can add to or take away from this however you think appropriate.

Meteorite Hunting Association: 'Tentative Mission Statement'

"To further meteorite science through the ethical and responsible recovery of meteorites and to share that knowledge equally with the scientific community and public at large."

Any gripes, opinions and thoughts are appreciated. Comments are welcomed both here and on the post on my site which has more detailed information.

http://www.meteoritesusa.com/meteorite-articles/meteorite-hunting-association/

Regards,

Eric Wichman

Meteorites USA

Hi, Thanks for the kudos on the site!!! ;) I hope people feel the same way about the MHA. We'll see...

Perhaps the MHA topic could be moved to it's own thread titled "Meteorite Hunting Association" so as not to step on John B's thread?

Thanks...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

you can count me in Eric

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hello Eric! My questions are: 1) How much per year? 2) Who gets the money, and what is done with it? 3) Who are the founding "professional" Board members? 4) How will this association help me? 5) Eric, are you really a "professional" meteorite hunter, or do you have a day job like the rest of us?

Cheers! - Terry

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hello Eric! My questions are: 1) How much per year? 2) Who gets the money, and what is done with it? 3) Who are the founding "professional" Board members? 4) How will this association help me? 5) Eric, are you really a "professional" meteorite hunter, or do you have a day job like the rest of us?

Cheers! - Terry

Hi Terry, thanks for the questions... I'll try to answer as thoroughly as possible but keep in mind we're still forming the association.

--------------------------------------------------

1) How much per year?

This has yet to be determined and is taking into account the costs of formation of the organization, the design and printing of educational materials, and the time it takes to complete all.

2) Who gets the money, and what is done with it?

The formation of the organization as a legal entity (i.e. an LLC or possibly a non-profit is being discussed). The money collected through membership "dues" and/or subscription "fees" will go to day to day operations and publishing of educational materials that promote the MHA and the science of meteoritics to the public, as well as help provide funding for group outings, events and other fun and educational activities sponsored by the MHA. A more detailed prospectus will be available once the organizations legal status is determined and formed.

3) Who are the founding "professional" Board members?

I am the founder. There are also some trusted "professional" advisers and meteorite hunters whom I have been consulting with. There is no official "board" yet formed. The board once formed will consist of members of both the meteorite hunting and scientific community. I would like to see a diverse group of board members with different backgrounds and professions to promote cooperation and present to the public a diverse and unified organization.

4) How will this association help me?

It depends on what you want because everyone want something different. Do you want more quality meteorite information, data and science? Do you want to be part of an organization that will help create and promote technology, publications, and educational materials that will aid in the recovery of meteorites in the field? Do you want to take part in fun group outings, events and activities with friends and fellow hunters who are part of a unified group that promotes meteorite hunting to the world? Do you want to be a part of a group that educates the public about meteorites? Do you want to join an association of like minded individuals who are made up of a diverse group of meteorite hunters, scientists, and enthusiasts who will work together to promote meteorite hunting in a positive light to the world? Do you want to help preserve the rights of meteorite hunters to hunt meteorites?

By becoming a member of the Meteorite Hunting Association you will be showing your organized support for other meteorite hunters, the MHA and the principles and positive promotion of meteorites described above. You will be part of a group that works for the preservation of meteorite data that is vital to advancing the science of meteoritics, while at the same time you will help build an organization that works closely with scientists, institutions, universities, and the public at large.

5) Eric, are you really a "professional" meteorite hunter, or do you have a day job like the rest of us?

For about 3 years I've been hunting meteorites, studying meteoritics, astronomy, and related sciences. I do have a day job of sorts, I'm a self employed freelance web and graphic designer by trade, as well as a web marketing and online business consultant.

--------------------------------------------------

If we as meteorite hunters can build the MHA into a respected organization and can accomplish just a fraction of what I've described above then I will consider it a success.

In a word, it's all about education. And with that education comes knowledge and the advancement of meteorite science.

Oh yeah, and we get to hunt meteorites too... ;)

Regards,

Eric

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

With the persecution of Meteorite Hunters begining to wax, I first of wonder what you have planned to address that issue. Secondly, with said persecution, would putting my name on a list, help or hurt, in regards to being "tagged" as such.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

With the persecution of Meteorite Hunters begining to wax, I first of wonder what you have planned to address that issue. Secondly, with said persecution, would putting my name on a list, help or hurt, in regards to being "tagged" as such.

Hi,

You're asking me to predict the future of an association that does not yet exist, or an hypothetical situation involving members which have not yet joined. Certainly I would hope that the MHA could have some positive influence on the public's perception of meteorite hunters and realize their value to the meteorite world and the science of meteoritics. Having said that I would also hope that there will be no negative effects of being a member. On the Contrary I believe that the MHA will be a boon to the meteorite hunting community and one that supports the membership base and scientific community wholeheartedly.

Regards,

Eric

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks for the answers Eric, and I sincerely wish you the best of luck with your new organization. - Terry

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi,

You're asking me to predict the future of an association that does not yet exist, or an hypothetical situation involving members which have not yet joined. Certainly I would hope that the MHA could have some positive influence on the public's perception of meteorite hunters and realize their value to the meteorite world and the science of meteoritics. Having said that I would also hope that there will be no negative effects of being a member. On the Contrary I believe that the MHA will be a boon to the meteorite hunting community and one that supports the membership base and scientific community wholeheartedly.

Regards,

Eric

Understood...But I am more worried about our Governments opinion right now that I am the publics. I think the "publics perception" of Meteorite hunting is either non caring or at best, ok with the endeavor. Again our loss of freedom to hunt for anything at this point is being challenged by elected officials, not the public. Hell....they are talking about severly cutting areas of fishing for christs sake...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Understood...But I am more worried about our Governments opinion right now that I am the publics. I think the "publics perception" of Meteorite hunting is either non caring or at best, ok with the endeavor. Again our loss of freedom to hunt for anything at this point is being challenged by elected officials, not the public. Hell....they are talking about severly cutting areas of fishing for christs sake...

I understand your frustration... I don't see the MHA as a political organization and I can't say if the MHA will take an active role in lobbying the government for anything, but I can say I support the rights of the public to hunt, fish, and for recreation on public land.

The MHA is meant to further the science of meteoritics by growing the meteorite hunting community and promoting a unified community with a common purpose.

So lets hunt!

Regards,

Eric

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks for the answers Eric, and I sincerely wish you the best of luck with your new organization. - Terry

Me too... Thank you Terry! I appreciate the kind words.

Regards,

Eric

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi Eric and All

Me thinks the problem originated with those that are in the business of commercializing meteorites. Those are probably similar reasons fossil, artifact and bag and possetion laws are in place as well. My guess is you can look on ebay or web surf and see many franconia, gold basin, glorietta, canyon diablo and others from public domain, private properties or areas closed to hunting that are openly marketed. I personally have no problem with people who deal in them but it don't take a brain surgeon to figure out it creates a black market and lots of less than desirable results. A small group of property owners with a legitimate bitch can make alot of noise. In todays climate of restrictions and eco freindly crap that makes it difficult for hard exceptions. I think the only way to proceed is through lawsuit or challange any citations. Other than that our best hope is someone like Jeff Grossman and university professinals explaing the errors of this new ruling and it detriment to the sciences. Happy Huntin John B.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi Eric and All

Me thinks the problem originated with those that are in the business of commercializing meteorites. Those are probably similar reasons fossil, artifact and bag and possetion laws are in place as well. My guess is you can look on ebay or web surf and see many franconia, gold basin, glorietta, canyon diablo and others from public domain, private properties or areas closed to hunting that are openly marketed. I personally have no problem with people who deal in them but it don't take a brain surgeon to figure out it creates a black market and lots of less than desirable results. A small group of property owners with a legitimate bitch can make alot of noise. In todays climate of restrictions and eco freindly crap that makes it difficult for hard exceptions. I think the only way to proceed is through lawsuit or challange any citations. Other than that our best hope is someone like Jeff Grossman and university professinals explaing the errors of this new ruling and it detriment to the sciences. Happy Huntin John B.

Hey John,

Wouldn't you say that is a responsibility of the meteorite hunting and collecting community as a whole to promote the science of meteoritics to the public and the government, and not just the job of one man? I respect Jeff and agree with his view that there needs to be some compromise and allowance for the cooperation between the scientific community and the public to collect meteorites in the field.

Meteorite hunters are perfectly capable of preserving vital scientific data. Not to mention, if a meteorite hunter spends his own dime on equipment and sets out on an expedition in the desert risking life and limb against snake bite, heat stroke, hypothermia, wild animals, and wild people, for a find that's rarer than gold, wouldn't a fair split between the government and the finder be appropriate and beneficial to all involved? I may be preaching to the choir here, but this advances the science of meteorites and supplies both the scientific community and the private sector meteorites material for collection and study.

In my opinion it's the communities job to promote a "best practices" of meteorite hunting. The MHA can do that in a unified and cooperative way.

Wouldn't you become part of a group whose purpose was to promote meteorite science to the public as well as do what it could to provide motive for the government to continue to allow meteorite hunting and recovery on federal land?

All this griping about the federal land issue maybe moot though. Someone asked me a question a few days ago about the hunting on federal land issue, he asked, "It's not new... Are we creating a problem where there was none?" Maybe we should just shut up and not say anything, or perhaps we should yell from the rooftops.

"LET'S HUNT!"

Regards,

Eric

P.S. Desert and wilderness survival, safety, and equipment are also very important aspects of meteorite hunting. Being prepared in the desert is a MUST as most of you already know, but some of the newer hunters may not be as familiar with the desert and spending long hours swinging a detector across miles of desert lands. There are snakes, coyotes, big cats (which I've seen sign of on a recent trip) and drug smugglers and other illegals to watch out for if you're hunting near the border. There are loads of other dangers in the wilderness, and many times you will hunt miles from anywhere away from any modern conveniences. I've been to many places where I had ZERO cell signal and if something happened I'd have to "walk out" many miles just to get to a paved road.

The MHA can help promote outdoor preparedness and safety. Perhaps articles in publications and newsletters, periodicals or even a column in the magazine.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi Eric

First off I'm slighly confused on this new meteorite ownership determination. A couple weeks ago as per BLM and Forest Service web sites meteorites on thier lands were open to hunting and collecting with dailey and annual bag and possession limits. Now they are protected from collecting on all public domain lands and are the property of the Smithsonian. My confusion was over the determination over the battle of the Old Woman meteorite that now sits in Barstow Ca. After the finders walked away from the fight for lack of funds the BLM sued the Smithsonian and won posession of the meteorite less about 20% that it ( the Smithsonian) kept for study. If I'm understanding the legal determination properly the Smithsonian has no ownership interest other than scientific and since the Public Domain lands are owned by the public ( you and me)why the people we allow to manage our property are stealing our meteorites and giving them to the Smithsonian ??

During our Gold Basin discovery and early hunting. David Kring from the U of A took random samples from our BLM land finds. All of those were logged and recorded by the U of A and forwarded on to the smithsonian. Once permits were garned by the U of A for the hunting and recovering meteorites within the Lake Mead National Recreation Area. All of those finds were recorded by the U of A and forwarded on to the Smithsonian. I personnaly acounted for at least 20 kilos of gold basin the Smithsonian has in a shoebox in the basement somewhere. We never got squat from them for all our energy, gas, wear and tear or detector batteries. Not even a thank you letter or christmas card, nada, zip, zilch !!! I didn't find out till years later I could actually deduct my expenses for all the hunts on the rec area. But it was to late !! I think that maybe since meteorites are no longer allowed to be kept by the finders and are owned by the smithsonian when landing on public domain lands. That every time one walks out his front door and is awake he is now hunting for the Smithsonian and everything one does outside the home even commuting to and from work could and should be tax deductable !! I'm by no means a lawyer or CPA !! But if Sawmill will give me the name of his Attorney in Tucson I'll check it out !! Flimsey but hey maybe !! Happy Huntin John B.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

John B.

I will email the information for contacting

the attorney.

One thing that keeps banging around in my feeble

old brain is. Before starting a major legal project.

Someone needs to contact the State BLM director in

the Phoenix office and ask about any restrictions for

collecting meteorites.

The National BLM site doesn't say a thing about new

restrictions . The only place I could find any thing

mentioned about not allowing any collecting was on the

Oregon and Washington site that you provided the link

to.

The Arizona BLM and Nevada BLM sites still say it is

OK to collect for personal use.

IT is really possible that the flunky that typed up

the Oregon and Washington site got it wrong. Wouldn't

hurt to double check with the Phoenix office.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi Greg

I have a new email address it's jbgoldmaster@gmail.com . You could be correct in your thinking but I was told that this change was comming by the forest service mineral dept. I don't think they would have any reason to care since thier job is to enchourage mining. They were the ones that told me this new opinion was on all public domain lands. Another concern no one has addressed yet is possesion. If the new ruling and determination of ownership is made then those that hold meteorites are now holding meteorites that belong to the Smithsonian. Could or would they make a demand for all meteorites to be turned in to the Smithsonian ?? Since the old ruling was not a clear ownership title issue. It only allowed you to collect and possess not sell, trade or barter . Making it now illegal to hold pre determination found meteorites ?? Hell maybe I could be raided and givin a ticket or 2 !! Happy Huntin John B.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi Eric

I think its a great idea! Especially getting the "Meteorite Hunters Code" out there. Cant wait to see the final draft.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

John B.

I understand what you are saying and agree,about

the ownership thing. You are 100 percent correct

about not being able to sell or barter,or retain

absolute ownership.

The facts are that the government can stop all

collecting period any time they see fit. And there

in little or nothing that we can do about that.

But the fact that they have allowed private collecting

for years plays a part too. Most old falls have been

classified and studied ,thanks to guys like you and

others. It seems that it would be perfectly ok to let

hobby collectors pick up the scraps.

You are right about the commercial hunting and sales

of meteorites causing big problems. It is totally against

the law to sell meteorites or buy them when found on

public land. Just getting caught selling one is a deal

breaker and makes hobby collectors look bad.

Serious collectors can always donate their finds to

museums or schools for study or display.

The point I am trying to make is that Oregon and Washington

was hit hard by the omnibus thing. Both states including

the Forest Service there is filled with enviros.

It is odd that the FS people sent you to the only site

that says anything about no collecting period. It is also

really odd that the National BLM site or other State BLM

sites don't say anything contrary to old rules.

Personally I think that the FS people you are dealing

with are just as anti land use as the person that wrote

the information on the Oregon,Wash site. When the FS and

BLM makes a decision for a complete halt of certain land

use ,that involves enforcement and fines,it is made very

public. They don't just post the rules on some obscure

state site,for the whole country.

There would be a record of decision on file with every

office involved too. That is why I suggest to go to the

State BLM office,or contact the regional FS supervisor,

not the local forest supervisor,or district ranger. If

they don't have it in writing contact the DOI or USDA

for any records.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi Eric

First off I'm slighly confused on this new meteorite ownership determination. A couple weeks ago as per BLM and Forest Service web sites meteorites on thier lands were open to hunting and collecting with dailey and annual bag and possession limits. Now they are protected from collecting on all public domain lands and are the property of the Smithsonian. My confusion was over the determination over the battle of the Old Woman meteorite that now sits in Barstow Ca. After the finders walked away from the fight for lack of funds the BLM sued the Smithsonian and won posession of the meteorite less about 20% that it ( the Smithsonian) kept for study. If I'm understanding the legal determination properly the Smithsonian has no ownership interest other than scientific and since the Public Domain lands are owned by the public ( you and me)why the people we allow to manage our property are stealing our meteorites and giving them to the Smithsonian ??

During our Gold Basin discovery and early hunting. David Kring from the U of A took random samples from our BLM land finds. All of those were logged and recorded by the U of A and forwarded on to the smithsonian. Once permits were garned by the U of A for the hunting and recovering meteorites within the Lake Mead National Recreation Area. All of those finds were recorded by the U of A and forwarded on to the Smithsonian. I personnaly acounted for at least 20 kilos of gold basin the Smithsonian has in a shoebox in the basement somewhere. We never got squat from them for all our energy, gas, wear and tear or detector batteries. Not even a thank you letter or christmas card, nada, zip, zilch !!! I didn't find out till years later I could actually deduct my expenses for all the hunts on the rec area. But it was to late !! I think that maybe since meteorites are no longer allowed to be kept by the finders and are owned by the smithsonian when landing on public domain lands. That every time one walks out his front door and is awake he is now hunting for the Smithsonian and everything one does outside the home even commuting to and from work could and should be tax deductable !! I'm by no means a lawyer or CPA !! But if Sawmill will give me the name of his Attorney in Tucson I'll check it out !! Flimsey but hey maybe !! Happy Huntin John B.

Hi John, I think the those who "interpreted" the Act are a little confused too. ;) People have been hunting meteorites and providing them for collection and study for decades. Why shut off the flow and stifle the science because a few think that only the privileged should recover meteorite in the field?

Meteorites that "sit" in boxes are of no value to anyone but those with authorization to access them. I'm not saying open up the collection vaults for every Tom, Dick and Mary, to peruse through, but I think putting a larger selection on display throughout museums elsewhere around the country and world is good. Use the collections and place a lot of the material on loan with trusted museums and institutions for everyone to enjoy and learn about.

As for those making the laws. They probably don't know much about meteorites, and typically listen to those that have that knowledge. The people that have their ear are probably the ones with strings of letters behind their names. No offense meant to those who have strings of letters behind their names... ;) I'm certainly not saying anything ALL encompassing with that statement, and I'm sure there are lots of scientists that support the recovery of meteorite in the field by capable individual meteorite hunters.

The only way I know of promoting a good change is at the very least by helping promote meteorite hunters in a positive light. This goes to the motive of the federal government to keep the meteorites off limits. Ask yourself "Why" they want to keep them off limits. Why do they seemingly want to hoard the meteorites?

Technically if you think about geological time, it's nothing in the scheme of things to a meteorite to sit in the desert for another hundred years. This is probably the logic and argument of those who have the ear of the government. The meteorites aren't really going anywhere, so what's the rush to pick them up. You could argue that new falls will be ruined, but they happen everyday somewhere on the planet, and as technology advances so too will the number of recovered new witnessed falls.

My point is not to discourage... To really make a difference and have a positive influence people in this community are wanting, there should be an organized effort to promote meteorite hunting in a positive, intelligent and capable light.

The MHA can help do that. I'm not saying the primary purpose of the MHA should be political activism, but rather that it takes a group effort and support to accomplish much of anything. Meteorite hunters have been working closely with scientific institutions for a long time and that should continue to do so.

Hunters have been providing valuable meteorite data and material for study and collection for a very long time, I don't see that changing unless meteorites are made off limits. If that happens then everyone suffers and the science and collecting will be slowed to a stand still.

Regards,

Eric

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi Eric

I have personally donated and paid shipping on Gold Basins, Franconias, Multiple Omanie meteorites (from known strewnfields in Oman) irigazites from kazakastan and various other pieces I've collected or where givin. To at least 100 different Universities, Museums and Planetariums world wide. Im not talking a couple grams either most all recieved at least a couple complete stones 100 gram or better and assorted slices depending on what I had available. Those that were looking for display material got the better and bigger pieces from my finds. I only kept my personal best or coolest of my finds which are now on loan to the Az Mine and Mineral Museum in Pheonix. These Butt Ugly space rocks don't make for nice household decorations. I do have a nice large scrap book of thank you and aknowledgement letters from most all I've sent them to. Including and offer to sit in a launch bunker at cape canaveral for a shuttle launch, a couple keys to citys, a nice plaque from the city of Los Angeles and multiple invites to visit thier museums. Heck I even have an asteroid named after me !! Ok Eric what have you done lately to enchourage the sciences ??

Happy Huntin John B.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi Eric

I have personally donated and paid shipping on Gold Basins, Franconias, Multiple Omanie meteorites (from known strewnfields in Oman) irigazites from kazakastan and various other pieces I've collected or where givin. To at least 100 different Universities, Museums and Planetariums world wide. Im not talking a couple grams either most all recieved at least a couple complete stones 100 gram or better and assorted slices depending on what I had available. Those that were looking for display material got the better and bigger pieces from my finds. I only kept my personal best or coolest of my finds which are now on loan to the Az Mine and Mineral Museum in Pheonix. These Butt Ugly space rocks don't make for nice household decorations. I do have a nice large scrap book of thank you and aknowledgement letters from most all I've sent them to. Including and offer to sit in a launch bunker at cape canaveral for a shuttle launch, a couple keys to citys, a nice plaque from the city of Los Angeles and multiple invites to visit thier museums. Heck I even have an asteroid named after me !! Ok Eric what have you done lately to enchourage the sciences ??

Happy Huntin John B.

Hi John,

Congratulations on all your accomplishments! Especially the asteroid. That's a great achievement! I would disagree though, that some space rocks are "butt ugly". They're all beautiful to me. Ok, most of them are. ;) I also want to commend you on your work and charity, it's very noble and a great thing you've done! Most people wouldn't do half what you've been able to accomplish and that you must be proud of.

First and foremost I have a profound and deep love for meteorites and the science they can teach us. I believe they hold within them the secrets of the universe and perhaps answers to some of humanities greatest questions. Everything within my being is extremely fascinated with meteorites, so much so that from the time I received my first meteorite back in Aug 2007 as a birthday gift I have dedicated my career to their study and collection.

Since that day, everything I do related to meteorites is to encourage the science, to educate the public and to provide meteorites for collection and study to both institutions and private collectors. I've created no less than 3 TOP 10 meteorite websites that promote meteorites and their science to tens of thousands of people.

I've reached and educated over 70,000 people about meteorites and the science behind them, and have offered those same people a chance to add a piece of the cosmos to their private collections. I've introduced countless people to the joy of collecting meteorites and started MANY private collections, most of those I've introduced still collect, will be lifelong collectors and perhaps may one day become meteorite scientists themselves.

I've supplied meteorites to universities, educational programs, school events, museums, observatories, and private collectors all over the world. I too have thank you letters from teachers and educators that use the meteorites they received from me for education. Many scientists and other individuals have benefited from my efforts to encourage the science.

People who would normally not have known that you could own a meteorite have been introduced to meteorites due to my efforts to educate and teach people about them!

Not to be self promoting or egotisitcal ;), but I've reached more people and educated more enthusiasts about meteorites than most people have even talked to in their lives. I've dedicated thousands of hours of my time to the study and hunting of meteorites and the promotion of the joy of their collection to the public. The direction of my life has been changed by meteorites and I will continue to promote them to the public at large in hopes that it will educate and advance the science of meteoritics.

So to answer your question, I've done a whole lot. More than most, and less than some.

But most importantly, I do it because I love it!

Regards,

Eric

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

We're moving forward with the creation of the MHA. Those interested in becoming a member please send me your full name so I can add it to the tentative list of members. I'll keep everyone updated on the formation of the association. Once the organization is created I'll contact everyone about completing your membership enrollment.

Or use the contact form here: http://www.meteoritesusa.com/contact/ Be sure to include your email address so you can be contacted once we officially start accepting members.

Just as a side note, the MHA will have it's own website after we get a large enough membership base. There is an official website for the MHA currently in the planning stages. If you have questions or suggestions please send them over to me via email to "eric[at]meteoritesusa.com" (substitute [at] with the @ symbol)

Enjoy...

Regards,

Eric Wichman

MHA Founder

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Eric

This is just a little advice from an old

fart,that may save you and the rest of the guys

from blowing a lot of time.

Don't you think it would be in your best interest

to contact the AZ State BLM office in Phoenix and

the regional FS supervisors office for a legal

decision first?

If in fact meteorite hunting is outlawed,starting

a meteorite association would be about as popular

as a horse thieves society,and pretty much a waste

of time and energy. Most guys that have collections

from public lands may want to keep a low profile.

John B does not start rumors about something as

serious as his beloved hobby just to hear himself

talk. Where there is smoke you can usually find a

fire. There is one heck of a chance John B is right

on track.

Until someone gets the verdict in writing ,it may

be a good idea to lay low. :ph34r2:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The point of the MHA is not to fight the law, nor is it's primary mission to lobby the government. The main purpose is to educate the public thereby preserving scientific data, with that education comes knowledge and advancement. If the MHA were to make lobbying the government the primary mission, then it would most likely paint a target on every meteorite hunter who is a member. It's not about lobbying.

Rather than do that, I think we should create the MHA as a vehicle for the public to promote meteorites, meteorite hunting and the science to the public in general. More to the point, in a way that doesn't "go against" the government but respects their point of view, but at the same time will not stand idly by if they believe the rights of the public are being infringed upon.

To address your concern: "...If in fact meteorite hunting is outlawed,starting

a meteorite association would be about as popular

as a horse thieves society,and pretty much a waste

of time and energy. Most guys that have collections

from public lands may want to keep a low profile..."

This is akin to sticking your head in the sand (no offense) and hoping things change for the better. Your comment also only takes into account federal land. It does not consider the private lands, and public lands (State & County) where permission can be granted to hunt. I believe every citizen in the USA should have the right to hunt meteorites on federal land. There should be an allowance for private sector meteorite hunting and collecting in the field.

It does not affect anyone who has meteorites in their collection now either. Only future finds. Those who wish to "lay low" may want to. But I think they will be doing the meteorite world a disservice by doing so. Complaining about something that's not fair, then not doing something about it, is not the point and would be defeatist in my opinion.

Could it attract attention by voicing your opinion? Yes, It's about having a voice!

It's to make people aware that there's science out there that needs to be preserved, and private sector individuals that are not only capable of protecting that science but that they have a "right to protect" it too. It shouldn't be limited by restriction, but rather should be progressed through responsible recovery. It should be available to everyone who believes in the freedom of collection and advancement of the science.

The more people who hunt meteorites and who actually know how to hunt meteorites properly, the faster the science will advance. PERIOD!

Veterans can teach, amateurs can learn, and more data is preserved. If you just say "NO! You can't hunt there!" you don't teach people anything, you remove motivation for any kind of recovery, and the science suffers. One being that those people not educated in meteorite recovery will do it anyway and never report it thereby science loses, and secondly if you remove all motivation for education, people won't care about recovering meteorites as there will be no reason to because if they say something they'll get in trouble. This ultimately slows progress, decreases data recovered and provides no material for study or collection.

We're all in the same boat, the government, the individual meteorite hunter, and the scientific community, but it seems some are paddling in opposite directions. I would like to see the MHA, the public, the government, and the scientific community all work together to paddle in the same direction, instead of going round and round in circles about who owns meteorites, or by making them off limits. This type of mentality is restrictive, persecutes, and alienates those who love and would otherwise be a boon to meteoritics.

The science will benefit from a group like the MHA. There's lots of very professional individuals and caring people who love meteorites, nature, and believe in what the MHA stands for. The MHA is an organization that promotes all of this in an equal and cooperative manner.

We can appeal to the government when there's something that may infringe on our rights to recover and collect meteorites.

The point is to create a group that educates, inspires, and provides meteorites to the public and the scientific community for BOTH collection and study. There's no need for any one group to hoard all the meteorites and information.

You could start an entire network of government and privately sponsored museums in each and every state with the meteorites that are sitting in university and institutional collections. Universities and institutions could loan meteorites to these museums for the sake of educating the public. It's really not limited to just a few people banding together to create a meteorite hunting group. It's much more than that.

I believe we have a responsibility as meteorite hunters, to promote meteorites and meteorite hunting to the public at large. If we truly love meteorites laying low is not an option.

Regards,

Eric

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×
×
  • Create New...