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John B.

Hunting/collecting meteorites on public domain lands

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Hi All

After finnaly getting a link to the Forest Service Web site with rockhounding rules for collecting meteorites. I sent it over to the Forest Service fellows that were telling me it's illegal. They just sent me this link and advised me the old link/web page was comming down. Apparently our new administation is putting a kabash on meteorite huntin /collecting. It will be interesting to follow the first challange to this ruling. Here's the new link which will be on all BLM/Forest Service sites.

http://www.blm.gov/or/programs/minerals/noncollectables.php

Happy No Huntin John B.

Hows that change working out for you now??

PS If anyone that is on the meteorite central meteorite list could post this on there I'm certain they will be soooo proud of new administration. They all hated Bush !! dumb asses

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From the link:

"If a meteorite is found on federal lands, then government officials consider it to belong to the government and, under an interpretation of the 1906 "Antiquities Act," meteorites found on federal lands belong to the Smithsonian Institution. National parks and public lands generally prohibit removal of rocks from them."

WTF, I thought those federal lands belonged to the public, which would mean they belong to the people, and not the government! Times sure are changing.

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Great post John B! Thank's for keeping us updated! - Terry

Hi All

After finnaly getting a link to the Forest Service Web site with rockhounding rules for collecting meteorites. I sent it over to the Forest Service fellows that were telling me it's illegal. They just sent me this link and advised me the old link/web page was comming down. Apparently our new administation is putting a kabash on meteorite huntin /collecting. It will be interesting to follow the first challange to this ruling. Here's the new link which will be on all BLM/Forest Service sites.

http://www.blm.gov/or/programs/minerals/noncollectables.php

Happy No Huntin John B.

Hows that change working out for you now??

PS If anyone that is on the meteorite central meteorite list could post this on there I'm certain they will be soooo proud of new administration. They all hated Bush !! dumb asses

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Hi Guys,

Does anyone have a copy of the old link/old rules? I don't think they can change codified law that easily. I don't recall the congressional hearings where this change was made? Anybody else? Catch a whiff of that strange scent in the air......................it's the smell of Fascism.

Ben

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Has anyone told the metorite men from TV? John, What did the rules say before you got this link?

Bunk

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Hi All

Ben the link I sent to the Forest Service is the link that was posted on another topic. It has already been deleated by the Forest Service. Bunk that link said they were legal to hunt and collect with daily and annual bag and possesion limits for personal use only no trading, selling or bartering. Their new stupid link is incorrect. The smithsonian lost ownership in a lawsuit to BLM in the 1960s. The Smithsonian don't own squat other than samples of the pieces found. After the Old Woman legal fight in the 1960s suddenly the bag and possesion and personal use were instituded befor the next whopper could be found. The real sad part about this moronic determination by someone who doesn't understand case presidence. The scientific community will loose in the long run. Now collection data will be falsified and material available for study severely diminished. I wonder what little dictator put this crap into policy?? Happy No Huntin John B.

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Anyone organizing a fund raiser and legal challenge to this?

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Hi bob

I'll chip in a couple grand, maybe more in defense of the first citation for huntin/collecting. That is the only way to challange thier determination. I think a couple of Tucson clubs as well might ??

Happy Huntin John B.

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Hi All

An easy solution to this problem :hmmmmm: . Walk around with a leaverite in your pocket :rasberry: . Hope for a ticket :hahaha: :hahaha: !! The rangers I've met would know a meteorite if it fell outa the sky and hit them in the head :whaaaa: !! Happy Huntin John B.

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I posted the same link as John

after his post.So I deleted it.

But this new development has some

serious effects on not just

meteorites,but prospecting too.

What happens when you hit an old

bullet or junk with your pick when

digging a target,and someone drops

a dime on you or an officer walks

up?

Notice on the second law that it

is anything over 10 years old now.

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OK Everyone

I know its late,but this crap got my dander up.

I did some research,after looking over John's link.

Who ever wrote up that little fiasco needs to find

another job. It is full of typos and bum information.

Someone took some real liberties with some documented

facts. If those Bozo's that John is dealing with are

using this as a guideline for law enforcement,they need

a new job.

Here is the genuine article in the original document

from 1979 ,that reads quite different than the self serving

link created by some flunky.arpaa.pdf

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LIFE HERE IN THESE UNITED STATES.........

IS REALLY GETTING RIDICULOUS ...........

'''''REMEMBER FIRST THE METEORITES THEN THE GOLD'''''

WHEN METAL DETECTORS ARE "OUTLAWED " ONLY OUTLAWS WILL HAVE METAL DETECTORS... SOUND FAMILIAR ????

AND DONT FORGET " BEING FINED FOR CARRYING "TRASH" ON PUBLIC LANDS NOT FOR DUMPING OR ABANDONING IT THERE.

WHERE THE HELL IS ARLO GUTHRIE WHEN WE NEED HIM WITH HIS 27 8X10 GLOSSY PHOTOS ????????? ALICES RESTAURANT ?????

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Double post bad connection at 3 AM

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Hi Sawmill, Isn't this what the Obama gang are doing with their "change" Changing everything to meet with their liberal fascism agenda. Soon you will have to post lookouts to hunt or beat the goverment goons off with your meteorite cane. Bob

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Beeper Bob

This kind of stuff will only fly if we are dumb

enough to believe it.

The rangers John is dealing with is getting their info

from bad info posted by other federal employees ,and not

from the actual rules and laws. These people are reaching

way out there for their excuses.

I even pulled up the current BLM handbook for dealing

with historic items and artifacts. It hasn't changed and

reads quite different than the crap posted on that web site.

Historical artifacts have to be of significant value and

not just random junk. Native artifacts can be anything made

by native tribes including arrowheads. All native artifacts

are protected ,and you can get busted for just moving an

arrowhead.

I agree that since obama showed up,all the lefties and

greenies in official positions are trying to force their

will on citizens ,by deception and twisting things to suit

their agenda . I think a few good ass kickings in court is

what they need.

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Personally, I am always going to carry a fat hematite chunk in my trash bag............ Civil disobedience........ how about announcing a large public invited meteorite hunt on some of OUR PUBLIC land? I would drive many miles to attend that!

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Heck Yeah,

I'll attend that Public Meteorite Hunt too! I'll invite all my friends and family, and make a day of it. Bring your camera!

Ben

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Yo All...So I guess this puts the meteorite department in Tucson at the university pretty much criminal associates, partners in crime, etc. ... And all the museums and universities that have purchase meteorites from private finders as buyers of stolen property?????????????? Or do they just switch law on a case by case basis? I did have a thought that perhaps we all should just shut up about this since nobody seems to be really chasing down and killing space rock hunters??? Cheers, Unc

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Yo All...So I guess this puts the meteorite department in Tucson at the university pretty much criminal associates, partners in crime, etc. ... And all the museums and universities that have purchase meteorites from private finders as buyers of stolen property?????????????? Or do they just switch law on a case by case basis? I did have a thought that perhaps we all should just shut up about this since nobody seems to be really chasing down and killing space rock hunters??? Cheers, Unc

I love that Ron, BTW this new forum format totally screwed-up your "signature"!

OK, many have stated they can't find the original internet links to the regulations or specific law as posted to same on the Net. I stared doing something which doesn't rely on a "bookmarked" page link on my computer to retain the info from one source to another....."save the information" on a CD to include date and time, source and place / link. It works and Katie bar the door if I find myself in court on this garbage! :eee: :ROFL:

Gary

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Looked it over and it kinda veg, So as far as im concerned it still game on, as if they gonna stop me anyways lol.

We should start A.O.M.H = association of meteorite hunting, so we can help the fight for the right to hunt on blm lands.

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Beeper Bob

This kind of stuff will only fly if we are dumb

enough to believe it.

The rangers John is dealing with is getting their info

from bad info posted by other federal employees ,and not

from the actual rules and laws. These people are reaching

way out there for their excuses.

I even pulled up the current BLM handbook for dealing

with historic items and artifacts. It hasn't changed and

reads quite different than the crap posted on that web site.

Historical artifacts have to be of significant value and

not just random junk. Native artifacts can be anything made

by native tribes including arrowheads. All native artifacts

are protected ,and you can get busted for just moving an

arrowhead.

I agree that since obama showed up,all the lefties and

greenies in official positions are trying to force their

will on citizens ,by deception and twisting things to suit

their agenda . I think a few good ass kickings in court is

what they need.

By the way,arrowheads on the surface are exempt from the archeological law: (g) Nothing in subsection (d) of this section shall be deemed applicable to any person

with respect to the removal of arrowheads located on the surface of the ground.

Cheers, Unc

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Hi All

In my humble opinion. I've been involved in this pretty long and have had several discussions with the legal minds on this. This new ruling is counter productive to all aspects of meteorite studies. I from day one was advised selling or wheeling dealing finds from gov lands was taboo and have abided by that. I think that is the reasoning behind this new ruling. Although if a legal challange was made and all arguments heard I'm conviced this ruling would be reversed. The only problem is it can be a very expensive task taking on uncle sam. Since their pockets have no bottom and legal battles can drag on for years. I'm at a loss for direction but open to all suggestions. Happy No Huntin John B.

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Hi John, Environmental groups sue the BLM, Forest Service and every other Federal agency to get policy changed every day. I recently discovered that their pockets aren't as deep as I thought, in fact, they are getting deeper each time they sue. Because of a federal law, those groups legal fees are paid by the federal government, no matter how inflated or unjustified. Just another example of the raping of the American taxpayer. when I get more time, I'll post some links verifying what I'm saying, or you can Google the subject and read it and weep. Later...Jim P.

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Uncle Ron

I hope you don't get caught picking up an arrowhead.

Check out the stuff that was thrown in with the omnibus

lands bill package. They can take your vehicle ,detectors

and fine the heck out of you for just removing a broke

arrowhead or pottery shard. Any native artifact is covered

surface or not if its on public land.

Also if you even accidentally disturb a fossil that has a

back bone no matter how small. look around very carefully ,

make sure you don't leave anything that could identify you,

then ease on out of there. DO not seek the treasure! :yikes:

The omnibus bill is where John's friends down at the FS is

getting their new found powers. :ph34r2:

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Nate is thinking of something that has actually been on the minds of many hunters for a long time now.

I've been talking with and proposed an idea some very well known hunters a while back about the formation of a "Meteorite Hunting Association" and other informative and educational meteorite related programs and they think this is a great idea!

Meteorite hunters have supplied universities, museums and scientific institutions with meteorites for study for decades. The laws are not new, but the publicity the meteorite world is getting is. More and more people are learning about meteorites and are realizing the fun and adventure that one can have hunting meteorites. But, there is a "code" or creed that all professional meteorite hunters go by, one that should be organized into a cohesive association. You can take part by joining the Meteorite Hunting Association. It's time for organization that brings together professional hunters that want to take part in something bigger than themselves. There will be more information available on how to join soon.

Right now your suggestions and opinions are welcome and now is the time to express them as the association is created so they can be considered and/or added to the associations list of criteria and/or rules of the road.

First thing. What do you think the mission of such a group should be? Below are my thoughts on this... You can add to or take away from this however you think appropriate.

Meteorite Hunting Association: 'Tentative Mission Statement'

"To further meteorite science through the ethical and responsible recovery of meteorites and to share that knowledge equally with the scientific community and public at large."

Any gripes, opinions and thoughts are appreciated. Comments are welcomed both here and on the post on my site which has more detailed information.

http://www.meteoritesusa.com/meteorite-articles/meteorite-hunting-association/

Regards,

Eric Wichman

Meteorites USA

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