Jump to content
Nugget Shooter Forums
Sign in to follow this  
azdigger

Mike Furness , got a question

Recommended Posts

Posted (edited)

Hi Mike, got a question for ya....your opinion please on an Acsend H10  sit In Kayak . 

Dr said I should not get my feet wet due to ulcers from Diebetis.  Was hoping you might have an opinion on this model . if not  , any ideas on a sit in kayak about a 10 footer so it will fit in my van.

Thanks

I welcome any other suggestions too.

Edited by azdigger

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Get a plastic paddle boat, had one and was great for fishing, both hands free light weight, on weekends had my three kids, two on each side of me and one in back.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

won't fit in my little van , I have a chevy venture van.    I am looking for  something I can load and unload with out much trouble.

A Kayak I can load in my van or tie it on top of my little pop up camper

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Get yourself an inner tube. Much cheaper and more fun.

  • Like 1
  • Sad 2
  • Irritated 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Can't get my feet wet in the lake, almost lost my left foot due to getting it wet in the lake....whole reason for a Sit In Kayak.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Rick ... The Ascend H10 is a stable mix of a canoe and a kayak. For folks of smaller stature than you or me it is a great fishing platform that will actually allow one to stand and fish ... sight fish if you will. it is light ... about 55 or so pounds as I recall ... and therefore should be easy for you to load into the van. If you get the H10 Hybrid you get gear tracks and hatch covers I believe ... however the 'hatch covers' are more like rain covers as there are no sealed hatches in this kayak. Like a canoe it is open from bow to stern. It does have a relatively comfortable slightly raised seat as well. You or I would have to be a little cautious getting in/out of the kayak because of the small size of it compared to our own size ... heard rumors you may have lost a bit of weight though. As for not getting your feet wet as your doc is suggesting ... well ... probably won't happen except when getting in/out of the kayak. But that is as good an excuse to buy one as any excuse would be for a little exercise.  Be sure to get a decent paddle ... for you I would say a minimum size would be a 240 cm with a cost around $40 or perhaps a little more. The cheap $29 paddles at places like Walmart are just that ... cheap! I sell a lot of Carlisle Day Tripper paddles as a good entry level paddle. Tempered aluminum shaft and poly plastic blade. I think Amazon has them for about $40 with free 2 day shipping if there isn't a kayak shop near you.

If you have further questions fire away. Happy to help.

Mike

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

A sit-in type of kayak can be almost impossible for a big man to recover. If you never go over in it then there is no problem. If you do then you will probably swim to shore after exhausting yourself trying to get back in your boat. If you are successful at getting in the boat there will be a couple five gallon buckets of water in there with you to deal with and you will be beat.

JMHO that an open deck boat similar to the Nucanoe would be ideal. They handle lots of weight, are easy to get on and recover easily. 

I am no expert on kayaks but I have paddled a thousand miles and paddled with dozens of people. For a young adventurer that wants to take on rivers a sit-in is the boat to have. For a mature fellow with some health issues I would say a sit-on fishing/touring yak would be the best bet.

Get a pair of scuba booties and neoprene socks. Your feet will never get wet even if you dump the thing. If you do dump your kayak, which is really easy to do, you need to be able to recover. Recovery with a sit in boat that fills with water when you flip it is a process that you MUST be able to do to survive on the water. It is much more complicated than a sit-on type and unless you are physically capable of handling a recovery with a sit-in boat I would strongly urge a sit-on.

Just my two paddles worth. Yak on brother!

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have had sit on kayaks, always seemed to get water in them, so my reason for sit in.....good thing is where I want to fish most of the time I will never be more than 2 rod casts from bank....and I float good (fat floats)…..I think if my ham gear sells I am going to go to Vegas to Bass Pro and get the Acsend H10...only weights 55 lbs and will fit in my van...

One of the places I want to fish is about 75 miles from home but 57 miles of dirt road...good fishing, have caught and released over 65 bass in a day there....

As far as stability I won't be standing and this Yak has a Tunnel type hull for stability...

Thanks Guys for the advise...want to fish

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
59 minutes ago, Morlock said:

Get yourself an inner tube. Much cheaper and more fun.

An inner tube is a recipe for disaster. I rescue a half dozen people a year who get blown out on the big water unable to paddle or navigate against the breeze. They are worthless in a current unless you just want to flow wherever the current (or breeze) takes you. An inflatable raft is worse. You can't pull one with an outboard boat against a stiff breeze. You must exert a HUGE amount of energy just to paddle on a clam day. 

I rescued a family of five last week. They got out of their ski boat (all of them) and were floating in the lake on tubes to cool off. They had no line to the boat. They were having fun, not paying attention and drifted several yards away from the boat. The slight breeze was blowing the boat away at a much greater speed than a tube could be pushed. They simply could not propel the tubes fast enough to catch it. A very common and very deadly mistake. 

Same with tubes on the river. A slight breeze will push you into a bank and there you are stuck. You can burn a thousand calories just to keep out of the bushes or you can carry the tube down the bank. You can't however paddle that tube down the river with even the slightest cross wind.

Comparing an inner tube or raft to a kayak is like comparing a hot air balloon to a small airplane. One is propelled in the direction you want to go. The other is almost completely subject to the forces of nature.

Honestly, getting more than a few feet away from the bank an inner tube is a dangerous proposition. They are great for holding air in a tire but they suck as a watercraft.

Edited by Bedrock Bob
  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Agreed re: tubes.  They're not steerable on snow, either, clam day or not.  In an earlier life, when I'd been bribed and bourboned into joining a volunteer fire department up north, we saw numerous tubing incidents per year, all of them involving collisions with trees, and most of them involving head or neck injuries.  Tubes belong in tires and slingshots, and the new ones aren't even much good for that.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
54 minutes ago, azdigger said:

I have had sit on kayaks, always seemed to get water in them, so my reason for sit in.....good thing is where I want to fish most of the time I will never be more than 2 rod casts from bank....and I float good (fat floats)…..I think if my ham gear sells I am going to go to Vegas to Bass Pro and get the Acsend H10...only weights 55 lbs and will fit in my van...

One of the places I want to fish is about 75 miles from home but 57 miles of dirt road...good fishing, have caught and released over 65 bass in a day there....

As far as stability I won't be standing and this Yak has a Tunnel type hull for stability...

Thanks Guys for the advise...want to fish

Hey AZ, I just looked at that yak. It is a hybrid! Sorta sit-in / sit-on. It would still fill with water if you dumped it but it looks like it would be easy to get up on. And I bet it has a double wall with an air cavity below the deck somewhere too. That would make it a whole lot better in a roll over. Maybe even self bailing.

A true sit-in is nothing but a water scoop and often fill up ENTIRELY causing you to bail or pump many gallons of water to even get them to float. You basically have a sunk 55 gallon plastic barrel with a hole in the side you need to empty. Then you need to crawl in that sucker without rolling it over again. I have seen young, strong people try two or three times to recover and simply become exhausted.

This yak will probably self bail once you get it turned keel to the water. It is wide and flat and might be a trick to flip over but it won't be any harder than a sit-on to get up on. So I think it is pretty neat.

I like it!  I hope you catch a yakload!

Edited by Bedrock Bob
Lets hunt yakalope!
  • Like 1
  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
On 7/27/2018 at 6:34 AM, azdigger said:

I have had sit on kayaks, always seemed to get water in them, so my reason for sit in.....good thing is where I want to fish most of the time I will never be more than 2 rod casts from bank....and I float good (fat floats)…..I think if my ham gear sells I am going to go to Vegas to Bass Pro and get the Acsend H10...only weights 55 lbs and will fit in my van...

One of the places I want to fish is about 75 miles from home but 57 miles of dirt road...good fishing, have caught and released over 65 bass in a day there....

As far as stability I won't be standing and this Yak has a Tunnel type hull for stability...

Thanks Guys for the advise...want to fish

What happened to that pontoon boat you almost sold me???

If it were me, I'd look for a used "Wilderness Systems" Tarpon 120 or 140 https://paddling.com/reviews/product/wilderness-systems-tarpon-140-kayak/

And a good pair of waders to protect the feet....

 

ETA:  In either a canoe or kayak, you'll probably be getting your feet wet when you either launch or recover....thus, the suggestion for waders....fishing vest too...

Edited by middleforkminer2
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Fix up an out rigger on it, like they use in hawii

 

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
18 hours ago, grubstake said:

Fix up an out rigger on it, like they use in hawii

 

I knew a guy who fabricated a tubular frame, bolted two SOT kayaks together and put a 5 hp motor on it...I'd have probably just used an electric motor.

  • Haha 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On ‎7‎/‎29‎/‎2018 at 6:44 AM, middleforkminer2 said:

I knew a guy who fabricated a tubular frame, bolted two SOT kayaks together and put a 5 hp motor on it...I'd have probably just used an electric motor.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hull_speed

He would go just as fast with a big paddle.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 7/29/2018 at 5:44 AM, middleforkminer2 said:

I knew a guy who fabricated a tubular frame, bolted two SOT kayaks together and put a 5 hp motor on it...I'd have probably just used an electric motor.

 

26 minutes ago, Bedrock Bob said:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hull_speed

He would go just as fast with a big paddle.

Easy fix, just add hydrofoils to the kayak and then that baby will fly!!

  • Like 1
  • Haha 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
14 hours ago, Bedrock Bob said:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hull_speed

He would go just as fast with a big paddle.

Even if that were the case,  how long would you last going FULL BORE with a big paddle???  With a little electric or gas motor, you could go all day....I used to have a 16 ft. canoe I carried on top of my van along with a little electric motor.....there's no way even two people paddling could have kept pace with that canoe.  I was poor at the time and couldn't afford a spare battery, so I'd pull the one from the van and go fishing.

 

ETA:.... I currently have a 24' pontoon boat with a 50 lb. thrust electric motor....unless there's a stiff breeze, it'll pull (because it's mounted on the front) my boat along at 4 mph (gps)

Edited by middleforkminer2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

A kayak will collapse if you propel it over hull speed. As soon as that hull lifts out of the water all the weight of the payload is distributed over a smaller area, and forces of the water pushing against it increase. You wont get past 10 mph before the kayak's hull collapses. It is just Tupperware.

Pull one behind your boat and find out for yourself. Use a strong bow line because it will take a couple hundred pounds of thrust to pull it over the hull speed with a person on it. And even being pulled from the bow the smallest wave will crush the bottom (or pull the cleats off the bow). It will turn sideways and try to grab waves if it is a keeled design. It will just plain catch an edge and dive if it is a flat bottom or recurve design. If you do succeed at getting it to slide on the water with a person on it  it will collapse the hull between the scuppers.

You can easily paddle a kayak as fast as it will go. A 30 lb thrust trolling motor on the lowest setting will propel a kayak as fast as it will go. If you crank the handle up to a higher setting it will make noise, vibrate, and try to push the stern around. But it will not plane or go much faster. If you increase the size of the engine so it will plane it will collapse the hull as it lifts the bow out of the water. 

A little aluminum skiff with a trolling motor will go faster than a kayak with an outboard. A kayak with a strong paddler can go faster than the skiff with a trolling motor. Putting any type of motorized propulsion an a kayak is a big step backwards. It is a lot like trying to put a motorcycle engine on bike. If you want to go faster then get a motorcycle.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, middleforkminer2 said:

Even if that were the case,  how long would you last going FULL BORE with a big paddle???  With a little electric or gas motor, you could go all day....I used to have a 16 ft. canoe I carried on top of my van along with a little electric motor.....there's no way even two people paddling could have kept pace with that canoe.  I was poor at the time and couldn't afford a spare battery, so I'd pull the one from the van and go fishing.

 

ETA:.... I currently have a 24' pontoon boat with a 50 lb. thrust electric motor....unless there's a stiff breeze, it'll pull (because it's mounted on the front) my boat along at 4 mph (gps)

I can last about 1.5 hours steady paddling at top speed (about one stroke per second. Maybe a bit faster). I can pretty much paddle all day (14 hrs) with short breaks and plenty of calories. I have covered about 25 miles a day but I think I could do twice that much if I was just travelling. I can paddle a kayak every bit as fast with a paddle as you can get the same kayak to go with any motor and that was my point. 

I have an old 16 foot Grumman and it is a bit faster than my kayak (hull speed again). But there is no way any canoe can keep up with a big racing kayak. So if you want to compare "a canoe" and "a kayak" there you go. Kinda apples and oranges but yeah, I can paddle as fast in a kayak as you can push a canoe with a trolling motor. And I can go every bit as far in a day too. The kayak I paddle today is not as fast as a canoe if that makes any difference to you. That being said the kayak is MUCH easier to paddle.

My point was that you can't put an outboard motor on a kayak and make it go faster! Nor would it make it better or more useful in any way. It would seem to be moving backwards. 

I am not sure how the pontoon boat is a comparison. I have an aluminum skiff that will go 7 mph with a 50 lb thrust motor. My 24 foot Sea Ray does not have a trolling motor so it goes zero mph. But neither of those facts indicate a kayak is faster or any better for its intended purpose with a motor strapped on it. 

Edited by Bedrock Bob

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Kayak fishing works for me, I make a couple of strokes then fish a bit, then make a few strokes and fish a bit....I only cover about 3 to 4 miles but I also get fish and that is what I am out there for. just love to fish and go slow, enjoy the sights and fishing.

After listening and reading a lot, I think I have decided to get  the Acsend H10 a hybred Kayak/canoe....open sit in for dryness on my feet and light so I can load in my little chevy Venture van.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, azdigger said:

Kayak fishing works for me, I make a couple of strokes then fish a bit, then make a few strokes and fish a bit....I only cover about 3 to 4 miles but I also get fish and that is what I am out there for. just love to fish and go slow, enjoy the sights and fishing.

After listening and reading a lot, I think I have decided to get  the Acsend H10 a hybred Kayak/canoe....open sit in for dryness on my feet and light so I can load in my little chevy Venture van.

That's it! The whole point is not to have to deal with all the hardware and noise and just keep it simple and quiet. 

If you are fishing the skinny water or travelling down a river you can't do better than a kayak. They just have not come up with anything better in the past few centuries and I have never heard of a modification that offers much improvement... including the touted pedal drives and electric motors. They are all expensive trade offs that offers very little benefit.

My primary criteria for a kayak is a thick sturdy hull. Hot temps make HDPE very soft and thin kayaks damage easily in transport. I have also seen quite a few collapsed from people sitting in them while beached. Lots of folks haul them sticking up over a tailgate and strapped tightly with ratchet straps. Consequently there are a lot of kayaks out there with creases where they have been folded up. Once you crease one it weakens them a lot. The hotter it gets the easier you are going to damage the yak.

Handles and rope hardware need to be reinforced. Some yaks have pop riveted hardware that just pull right out. Some are soft in the only place that you can run a strap across. Some have a shape that makes it impossible to haul without point bearing the load on a corner. I look at these things more than anything else now days. 

And many have been left in the sun. Sun eats the hell out of HDPE and they crack just like an old five gallon bucket. Seats and straps show sun damage before plastic will. I always look for faded seats and straps and signs of sun damage when buying a yak. There are LOTS of yaks that have not been stored properly that will break the very first time you strap them down or lean on a spot. 

Lots of yaks leak badly. My son's has a couple of gaping holes near the rear scuppers where the two molded halves were plasti-welded together. Just poor quality control. And many leak at covers and hatches. It is not uncommon to have to troubleshoot leaks. And it is not uncommon to wear holes in thin keels either. Especially on tidal pools filled with oyster shells or volcanic beaches. So grab a heat gun or soldering iron and learn how to weld HDPE. It will come in handy. 

Another tip is to go to Home Depot and get a roll of 1" backer rod. Stuff your paddle handle with this foam rod and it will give you good buoyancy when you are off the yak. You can use the paddle to float higher in the water and it can aid you in getting back in the boat after a flip. River rats stuff their paddles with foam and cut a piece of pool noodle to slip over the shaft to add even more flotation on the outside. If you go down you can almost get up on your paddle and float down the river on it!

Don't wear waders on a yak. If you flip they will just fill up and drown you or not fill up and float you head down. They are ultra difficult to get off in the water. Just like a duck hunter falling out of a duck boat and drowning with waders. Wear neoprene scuba booties or just leave your shoes untied so you can kick them off easy. Lots of guys drown with their feet in gear that pulls them down. Neoprene booties will not get wet inside at all... except from sweat. And there are some sweet zip up socks they sell that will keep your feet dry and comfortable. I wear zip up Scuba Pro booties with good soles. I can yak all day and not get wet. I could still walk a couple miles in the desert with them if I had to. They cost $10 at the thrift store.

Edited by Bedrock Bob
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Get yourself an anchor trolley for that yak. You will need one.  And make sure it has the bungees to securely stow the paddle.

You can't safely throw an anchor out without a trolley. And I put my fish stringer on my trolley and run it to the stern. It keeps the fish back there where they don't get in the way when fishing or paddling. I made my trolley but you can buy one for about $35. Make sure you can get inside the hull where you need to. Some yaks are impossible to reach without installing a hatch.

You can't fish with a paddle in your lap. If the boat does not have hooks and bungees for a paddle get a set and install them. A paddle leash is great when you are paddling but you won't like it when fishing. So you need a secure spot for the paddle that will work even when the wind blows you into a horny bush or the current pulls you under a sweeper. A bungee along the side of the yak or across the bow is perfect. 

Don't skimp on either. I find it impossible to catch fish without these accessories. When you start catching fish you need to be able to bring them in, get them off the hook and on a stringer, and get back in the water as soon as possible. In a kayak with a little breeze or waves with a paddle in your lap it is a juggling act. You will catch more fish and be a lot safer with the proper rigging. If your boat does not include this rigging my advice is to not leave the yak store without it. 

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, Bedrock Bob said:

I can paddle a kayak every bit as fast with a paddle as you can get the same kayak to go with any motor and that was point.

You can paddle this fast???  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dnubsg3FRq0

Old Town says about 5 mph with an electric...  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W7NK6SWEoq8

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, middleforkminer2 said:

You can paddle this fast???  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dnubsg3FRq0

Old Town says about 5 mph with an electric...  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W7NK6SWEoq8

First you had me racing an electric canoe in your mind. Now you have me racing an outboard kayak. What next? A jet ski?

Of course I cant paddle that fast! Don't be silly! But then that was not my point at all and I think you know that.

I can paddle that Old Town as fast as the trolling motor will push it. How about that? That is a fair comparison and illustrates my point about hull speed. 

The point of the discussion is that you are not going to make a kayak go on plane without overcoming some big engineering problems. If you do overcome these problems you get an inefficient boat that does not fill the niche of a kayak nor does it do the job of a skiff. That is really all I am saying and I hope that my feelings on this don't cause you too much anxiety. 

 

 

Edited by Bedrock Bob
To impart a feeling of tenderness and caring in my communication

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
Sign in to follow this  

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×